Jun 03 2007
Guest Worker Program Still Shows Support
The gnashing of teeth and pulling of hair and the cries of imminent doom and disaster from the far righyt have not been able to kill popular support for the immigration bill and the guest worker program so many immigration hypochondriacs fear to the point of proposing sticking with our current mess even longer. While down a bit, they proposal is not out by a long shot. And support springs back once some simple corrections are proposed.
A slim majority believe in creating a pathway to citizenship, with younger people and Democrats far more open to the idea than Republicans and those over 55.
The number in favor of a guest worker program is almost identical — 53 percent — but on this issue, almost as many Republicans as Democrats back the concept. Those in the Western part of the nation are most supportive of it (65 percent), as are those in urban areas.
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In the interviews, respondents to the survey also seemed conflicted over whether Congress should substantially increase the number of guest workers permitted in the United States.
The plan was supported by slightly more that half, but approval increased to 64 percent when a suggestion was offered: that the program be limited to industries where a shortage of workers has been identified by the government.
So support springs right back to the 2-1 numbers supporting Bush and his proposals once something is proposed that negates the fear-mongering theories. The Dems and media want to let the far right tarnish conservatism, which the far right is more than happy to do. But the immigration problem is so pervasive and without any easy answer (despite all those proffered by the far right, like enforce the laws – which got us into this state). Americans know this and understand perfection nor Nirvana are going to be coming out of DC. Watch for more polls to come confirming the obvious. This is our last chance to make changes for years to come on this decades old problem. Only those who rampaged against the status quo situation for years are the ones now calling for it to be salvages so that nothing is passed at all. An nobody is really buying that twisted logic.
More here on the poll and the new confidence the bill will pass the Senate
After a week at home with their constituents, the Senate architects of a delicate immigration compromise are increasingly convinced they will hold together this week to pass an overhaul of the nation’s immigration laws, with momentum building behind one unifying theme: Today’s immigration system is too broken to go unaddressed.
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Public opinion polls seem to support Kyl’s contention that Americans are far more open to the deal than the voices of opposition would indicate. In a Washington Post-ABC News poll released today, 52 percent of Americans said they would support a program giving illegal immigrants the right to stay and work in the United States if they pay a fine and meet other requirements. Opposition to that proposal was 44 percent.
The opposition is waning as the far right goes into hysterical fits. This is not coincidence. The over the top rhetoric has repulsed the nation – who knows something must be done. And a lot just simply don’t want to be associated with the tone and anger on the right. The far right broke one too many times with their ‘partners’ in the conservative coalition. Now that their only answer is to be a poison pill, they have marginalized themselves. Credibility is not something you can win back quickly. Bush is still very credible. His detractors on the right have none left. Watch as the bill passes, and America DOESN’T come to a crashing end.
Actually the problem is based in court decisions that interpreted the law to allow the anchor baby concept.
A new amendment is not required, just a landmark decision by the Supreme Court reversing the decision.
Study the history of it, it is based partially in old common law and other legal decisions drawing from that.
In any event the anchor baby issue makes the huff and puff and all the particulars of this bill whether it passes or not moot.
As long as that one concept is embraced in the law , all the other issues are only a band aid on the issue.
It will simply cancel out every other method that is likely to be invoked.
With or without this bill, the eventual result will be the simple supply and demand saturation of the market of all skill levels that are available from the immigrants.
At that point an equilibrium will eventually be established.
I am still waiting for the legal decision of if the anchor baby is based on where the child is delivered for birth or the country of origin where the child was conceived.
That will create all sorts of issues.
SallyVee
I am a bit at a loss as to how to respond to you.
You are welcome to your opinion as to the import and impact of this issue as all participants are.
However your denigration of those who may have studied the issue and done an assessment of the impact is purely a strawman of your own creation.
I could come back with a similar but different snarky remark, but I won’t.
Exit question. Can you understand why?
I think the biggest problem facing Bush and Kyl is that people just think it will not work, or it will make things worse. Attempts in the past have not worked out like they were supposed to and people think this will be the same thing all over again.
However, those people do have some responsibility to come up with a better idea. And that is what people are waiting for the critics and are not hearing. Considering the fact that they seem so convinced they have all the answers one wonders why that is so.
Terrye
We have come up with all the ideas, we know what has to be fixed.
If you haven’t seen that you haven’t been reading at all.
The issue is that the solutions are not being addressed in this bill and there is no way for those who know the faults to go up against the other driving forces behind this legislation.
We are not just picking at what is wrong to be picking, we are showing how it is faulty and doomed to failure.
Also as I said earlier, there are other structural issues that make whatever form this bill goes to is moot.
Read the numbers , look at the trends.
Heck even John McCaine came out yesterday and pulled a Royal from France similar position that opposition to this bill would create social unrest.
So many are looking only at this bill and there is a much bigger picture if you back up and look at what is at issue.
This is the red flag the guy in the ring with the bull is waving.
But remember it is still contained in a ring, which is still withing a city.
Concentrate on the flag and you are being fooled as much as the bull.
I have already addressed the anchor baby stuff many times.
Take a specific example.
In New Orleans right now 70% of the births are to Hispanics.
There goes Ray boy’s chocolate city claim.
Besides the non sustainable growth rates, which could be handled if they slowed down on a long term basis.
The main issue here is non assimilation and skill level matching.
It is self evident when you have mexican-americans and african-americans.
What needs to be developed is the same identification with the reversal puting american first and ethnic orientation later.
That is the crux of the problem.
Regardless of the form of this bill, the only solution is that all ethnic groups will have to say that I have got to toss of the my thing first and go to the lets pull together.
Hispanic isolation and black it ain’t cool to be whitey styled self destruction will not buy the ticket on this ride.
You can PC this out or you can bite the bullet and face the mirror.
Those choices will determine the outcome, not what all those guys and gals inside the beltway position themselves on.
For the supporters of the open borders type, what do you wish to get to?
Do you define success when we have thrown up shack houses like many south american countries have because they have saturated the job market beyond all reasonable support levels?
Have you even examined that?
Please tell me what your objectives are.
Even more important, tell me if you have never considered them.
That would say a lot.
Merlin,
When did any of us call for gutting the border provisions and wanting ‘open borders’. The difference between the immigration hypochondriacs attempts at labels and mine is mine actually reflect fairly accurately on their intentions and motivations. Calling me and Bush and others who support both the border component and the worker component open borders types just shows how little reality is in your arguments.
Call me a guest worker program supporter if you want. But I never said we should gut the border elements. I am for those completely – as much as I am for the worker element.
Sally Vee,
I did not expect them to go this far into the tank. When people do this, like many libs have done like Sheehan, there is no coming back. The become militantly anti-American because America turned out not to be want they wanted.
Some realize they may have gone too far. But not all. It is hard to walk back after putting so much on the line. Some will hate Bush and cons and America.
can someone plese help me to understand what is goin on with the amnesty? i know that it has not passed and may . how do i find out more
i am married to an illegal and the mother of two of his children. does any one know what i can do?
can someone plese help me to understand what is goin on with the amnesty? i know that it has not passed and may . how do i find out more
i am married to an illegal and the mother of two of his children. does any one know what i can do?
AJ
The way this bill is structured is almost open bordered.
The border measures are triggers and the registering starts immediately under this bill.
All the border stuff is “pending funding”. The other parts are mandatory.
Simple purse control can effectively gut this bill down the line which is what some of us have been saying.
Two times this has been attempted and both times it failed and the issue worsened.
Yet you trust the same people to tell you, yup we got it right this time for sure.
Sorry Merlin,
Open borders means open borders and no amount of spin will change the english dictionary.
If you folks cannot use words correctly, what makes you think people can believe a thing you say? Credibility. Bottom line is if people twist words on one matter they twist them on any matter. Including words like ‘trust’, ‘respect’, ‘alliance’….