Sep 16 2009
An Early I Told You So
I have been starting to raise the alarm bells that the ‘true conservatives’ where back at their same old bag of dumb tricks, pissing off natural political allies, alienating centrists and moderates, and in essence keeping them out of power and the liberals in power.
Susan Estrich pens an example of what I tried to say about Beck and others, about how they were more a negative than a positive. That these Pyrrhic victories were making it impossible for centrist dems and independents to feel comfortable in another conservative alliance:
Getting rid of Van Jones, the co-founder of one of the groups now organizing the boycotts, is not going to slow the movement. Quite the contrary. It may strengthen the cause. When folks start telling someone who has been a contributor at Fox for 10 years (me) to cut out the Claritin, you know it’s spreading.
The same day, I found myself sitting with a group of people who share my strong commitment to the security of the state of Israel. To a one, they supported Hillary or McCain. To a one, they have “issues” with President Obama: These folks are worried about the economy and the deficit, worried about terrorism around the world and, yes, deeply worried about what they see as ambivalence from this administration to the threats faced by Israel. But — and this is my point — despite all of that, every one of these people is now an angry Obama supporter. Not just an Obama supporter, but an angry one.
The right may be mad as hell, but I’ve got news for Congressman Joe Wilson and his know-nothing cronies: You have turned your natural allies, people who might have agreed with you on properly raised criticisms, who might have agreed with you on substance, into your enemies.
Not critics, enemies.
There have been others, like Charles Johnson of LGF, who raised the warning bells that well meaning and nice people (e.g., Jim Hoft of Gateway Pundit) were being extremely counter productive in their constant, over-the-top use of Hitler and Nazi imagery when discussing our young, inexperienced and probably well intentioned president.
When Obama starts rounding up people and sending them to concentration camps, then you can use the Nazi connections. Until then you are equating petty theft with mass murder, and it does no one any good to do so. It makes the right looks stupid, it makes Obama look like a victim (instead of inept), and it makes the Obama voters who are uneasy with the Obama’s performance cringe at changing their alliances.
As usual, the far right is ready, willing and able to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. They are coming on too hot, too haughty, too arrogant. Instead of a respectful “things are not going right, let’s try and fix it” they are just gleefully slinging mud and denigrating everyone.
I seriously doubt everyone in ACORN is evil and trying to break the law. We need to stop painting each other with broad strokes from occasional miscreant and malcontent. Estridge should not have called Rep Joe Wilson a racist simply because he could not take any more of President Obama’s BS. Wilson made a mistake and offered his apologies immediately and personally.
Get over it. But on the flip side, the far right has exaggerated the intentions and heart of many people in the Obama White House who sincerely believed their flawed beliefs. The political industrial complex is angry, because as a whole they are abysmal failures. That includes Estrideg, Obama and Wilson. It does not include President Bush, who kept his promise and kept it classy his entire 8 years, no matter the muck thrown at him.
I also condemn the established and those ‘up and coming’ pundits who think crass is kewl, and can fill in for thoughtful ideas. Begala and Glenn Greenwald are poison to America’s Democracy. Sadly, so is Pat Buchannan. I am waiting to see if the saintly side of Jim Hoft will win out over the demagogue who comes out when he blogs. I see more and more of the right falling into the Begala/Greenwald gutter mode. It is what killed the GOP and conservatism.
President Obama can beat back any hot headed, insulting argument they way President Bush did, by simply being calm and taking the high rode. The only way to push Obama is to convince sufficient numbers of his supporters to oppose him and align with the opposition. Insults will not help this happen, or make it happen.
Update: But this is not a premature “I told you so”, according to this news:
Realignment is dead. President Barack Obama and Democrats blew it.
Dealignment has arrived. Republicans blew it, and are now so repellent that Americans increasingly reject both political parties.
In the latest Washington Post/ABC poll, 43 percent of voters labeled themselves independents.
DC is not the shining city on the hill, that is America. It is now the swamp which needs cleaning out.
Crosspatch….it has been sent, to Poland and the Czech Republic. Two days ago Russia said they would support the US on sanctions for Iran. Guess they knew the end game.
Elections are won in the middle and as long as the GOP chases its tail over unpopular, idiotic, long lost social issues embraced only by the fringe right (eg. creationism, the anti-abortion movement), they will remain the minority party.
What can you expect from those who are treated like mushrooms by the FORMER msm, now the Fringe Media(abcnbccbscnnmsnbc): kept in the dark and fed crud.
If you want to be “in the know”, don’t count on the old networks. They ain’t givin’ you the full story…
And I hope tinian keeps believing what he’s been told by the fringe media, LOL!
Tinian,
The GOP is about role of government issues, not “creationism”. For example, Bush warned 8 years ago that we were headed for *exactly* the market crash concerning mortgages we are now seeing. His administration warned 7 years ago that it would likely spread beyond the government corporations into the general financial sector. In 2005 the administration warned that time was growing short and that inaction might result in catastrophic failure of the financial systems.
Democrats such as Maxine Waters, Charlie Rangel, and Barney Frank said in Congressional testimony that it was all a figment of the Republicans’ imagination.
If you like I can give you links to video of the testimony. Bush was warning about this in April 2001, the fourth month of his administration. The Clinton administration had set up the dominoes and Congress refused to do anything about it.
Tinian, the Democrats are responsible for this mess. 100% of it.
AJ
This post reminds me why I quit reading you. I think that the “Acorn Videos” are some of the most important investigative journalism since Watergate. Exposing the readiness of an organization that receives Federal, State and Local tax dollars to aid and abet in tax fraud and trafficking in under age sex slaves is IMHO the highest calling of journalists.
That you can toss this off as nothing says one hell of a lot about you.
Cross, great post. You nailed it, imho. I am copying it for furture use. 🙂
Tinian,
You think Reagan is dead and gone and so is his movement?
How about this?
Voters Turn Negative On All Political Labels Except Reagan
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_politics/september_2009/voters_turn_negative_on_all_political_labels_except_reagan
It’s also not a progressive nation. It is a center-right nation:
Conservatives Now Outnumber Liberals in All 50 States, Says Gallup Poll
http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/52602
You seem to be obsessed with social issues. Recent polls I have seen on social issues show the nation is center right, not progressive also.
But, either way…..
2010/2012 elections are not going to be about “social issues”. Haven’t you figured that out yet?
ivehadit, you asked:
“One question of clarification: Is it true that McCarthy was correct about the communists during the 50’s? I seem to remember something about soviet files that were opened after the cold war was over….I have heard this to be right but would like to know for sure….”
I didn’t see anyone answer, but the correct answer is yes. In general all, or almost all, of the people that McCarthy accused of being communists were actually communists.
Ann Coulter dealt with that in her book “Treason”.
The acorn videos are not being done by a political party. It is private investigative journalism being done by Andrew Breitbart et al. The criticism might make sense if “The Republicans” were doing it.
Here you have an organization that our President helped to train and acted as legal counsel for. It is tied to the SEIU who has close ties to our President. They get a lot of OUR money. The Obama campaign paid them to canvass for him. They registered voters.
The outright proven voter fraud wasn’t enough to show this as a dishonest, cheating, lying organization. Now we have seen video from five offices. All five wanted to help the “prostitute” get set up in business. All five wanted to assist in ways to scam the system. One even suggested that the under aged girls be claimed as dependents for tax purposes. Today we have an ACORN representative who propositions the “prostitute” for sex asking how much she charges and offers to assist in smuggling the girls across the border.
The investigators say they visited more offices and there are more videos. They said every single office they visited were receptive and suggested ways for them to set up a brothel.
And this reflects poorly on the investigator???? Are you out of your mind?
These people did not need to be “talked into it”, they didn’t need to be coerced, convinced, persuaded, nothing! When informed that they wanted to open a brothel, they were all about looking for ways to assist them even to the extent of proposing ways to get the “girls” to the brothels. They suggested ways to hide money, ways to use the brothel to avoid taxes. In one office the man posed as a politician rather than a pimp who wanted to use the brothel cash flow to finance his campaign and ACORN thought that was just swell.
Now tell me with a straight face how that reflects poorly on “the Republicans”.
Here we go again……
Dems push expanded Community Reinvestment Act; deny Act’s role in mortgage meltdown; GOP cites ACORN connection
A number of experts believe that aggressive enforcement of the 1970s-era Community Reinvestment Act contributed to the mortgage meltdown, and thus to the greater financial crisis, by requiring financial institutions to lend to unqualified borrowers. Now, the Democratic majority in the House of Representatives is responding to that situation by proposing to expand the scope and power of the Community Reinvestment Act.
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/blogs/beltway-confidential/Dems-push-expanded-Community-Reinvestment-Act-dismiss-evidence-that-CRA-contributed-to-financial-meltdown-Republicans-cite-ACORN-connection-59501737.html
It’s come to this: Noted rabid Bush-hater Andrew Sullivan is today “Praising the evolution of Charles Johnson.” Heh – a far cry from what he said about him back in the rathergate days.
Makes you wonder if they’ve started dating. Metaphorically, I suppose they have.
Johnson, meanwhile, is furiously working to protect the right of Child Sex Slave rings to operate without any scrutiny at all, and to receive government money to boot.
And he’s also doubling down on the claim that everyone at the Washington DC march was a racist. That means you, AJ.
You look at LGF these days, and all you can see is raw, unvarnished hatred. If that’s “centism”, I want none of it. And I can’t imagine any decent Americans who would.
For some reason, I really doubt the validity of this piece by Susan Estrich. So these anti-Obama voters became pro-Obama just because of Joe Wilson’s little stunt? So how many anti-Bush people became his supporters after the many, many insults thrown at him by the Democrats? Most likely none.
As a centrist, what angers me is not the insults, but the comments by Hannity and Rush about the need “true” conservatism. I respect both Rush and Sean, but Mark Levin appearing on Hannity last night and whining that we tried the “mush moderates” and that didn’t work. When did the GOP give moderates a chance? McCain? Give me a break. McCain is a moderate, but when the right wing base began whining about the results of the primaries, McCain had to make himself look like a conservative, and did a horrible job at it. Obama on the other hand, to anyone who cared to look, always was liberal, but he ran in the general election as more moderate. Guess which one won, folks? The guy who looked like a centrist (although he was completely faking it). And, if I remember correctly from that same poll where right outnumbers left in all 50, there are slightly more moderates than conservatives. If whining and blaming a plurality of the electorate for your failures is the mark of a “true” conservative, I’m glad I’m not one. A center-right coalition will definitely win. A party composed of only conservative ideas might win, if only marginally. I would rather win big.
If I understand correctly, the people in eastern Europe still fear the Russians. I hope the Poles and Czechs can forgive us. Not all Americans are as willing to appease evil as our President is.
AJ,
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I am calling B.S. on this post.
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Pretending that Susan Estrich was a potential ally is like pretending that the mythical Democratic “Liberal Hawks” were real allies in Iraq when the going got tough in 2005-2006.
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People like Susan Estrich think as follows:
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1) They truly believe that ACORN is a good and just organization that has simply been mislabeled by evil Republican fear-mongers.
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2) They truly believe that socialized medicine is an automatic good and corporations are an automatic bad.
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3) They truly believe that big government is the answer to all ills and the free market is the source of all those ills.
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4) They truly believe that people shouldn’t be allowed to use industrial farming because it’s bad for the environment.
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5) They truly believe that man has caused the temperature to rise so high that the seas are going to wash away their beachside condos.
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6) They truly believe that the only person who could find any fault with Obama’s policies is a racist. Because his policies are just so obviously perfect.
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7) They truly believe that inner city gang members are simply misunderstood and solely products of their environment. That if people just reach out to them enough they’ll all join in a rousing round of kumbaya.
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8) They truly believe that Islam is a religion of peace and Conservative Christians are a much greater threat to their ‘rights’ and lives.
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9) They truly believe that having an ‘Abort Bush’ bumper sticker is protected freedom of speech but having an ‘Abort Obama’ bumper sticker is a direct threat to the president and must be dealt with by law enforcement.
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10) They truly believe that anyone who disagrees with them is ‘hatemongering’ and ibid but that anything they say, no matter how dangerous in intent, is done for love so it’s okay.
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Relabel all of that in a less ‘in your face’ form and you’ll find that 80+% of members of the news media and the 20% of Americans that are the Leftist core of the Democratic Party agree with those 10 points.
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I’ve talked, argued, corresponded and with too many people who fall into this category.
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I even had one senior media type actually threaten me in private e-mail over a Wind of Change post criticizing him in the immediate aftermath of Eason Jordan being removed as a CNN editor (for admitting that CNN cooperated with Saddam’s propaganda machine for access).
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Most of these people either exist in a news bubble (possible if you’re a liberal) or simply have been so insulated from reality that they truly have a world-view that anything they believe, or are told to is the truth at a cocktail party, is absolute unshakeable Gospel.
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Tell someone along those lines a truth they haven’t had from an approved source (Bad Speak) and they’re automatic and instinctive reaction is to say:
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‘That’s not true.’
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Not
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‘Could you give me a cite on that?’
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or
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‘I have a hard time believing that, could you tell me where you heard it?’
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They simply say ‘That’s not true.’
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They truly don’t even know how to think about anything outside their small set of truths. Or they don’t like what they see so they repress the thought.
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An acquaintance of mine has had this happen to him *repeatedly* in conversations with his sister whenever the subject of terrorism comes up. All she can do is parrot the APPROVED TRUTH without thinking so she can avoid reality
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Friend’s Sister>> ‘Islam is a religion of peace.’
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Friend>>’Islam was the reason that nineteen hijackers flew planes into the buildings that used to stand at Ground Zero.’
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Friend’s Sister>> ‘Christian fundamentalists are more of a threat to my lifestyle (she’s a GLAAD board member) than Islamics.’
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Friend>> ‘Christians say you’re going to hell and want marriage to be defined as one woman, one man. Islamics want to stone you to death and define marriage as one man, as many women as he can afford and they don’t get to say no.’
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Friend’s Sister>> ‘I don’t want to think about it. We’re done talking.’
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This is why I see a Spanish Civil War coming for America.
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These people are dangerous, ignorant morons. There is no reasoning with them. Nothing short of a terrorist cargo container nuke or suicide terrorist vector spread small pox will change their world views.
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They are kind of dangerous morons who started the Spanish Civil War with Franco.
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And who were killed both during and after it by Franco.
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I weep for what I see coming because the social forces behind it are too big for any of us to avert.
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Any more than America’s Slaveholder’s Rebellion was prevented by Senators Clay, Webster, and Calhoon’s Missouri Compromise.
“For some reason, I really doubt the validity of this piece by Susan Estrich. So these anti-Obama voters became pro-Obama just because of Joe Wilson’s little stunt?”
heh – bingo, Marksbbr. Remember, Susan E. has ALWAYS been one of Hillary’s go-to girls, and it’s a very safe bet that she has never voted for *any* republican in her life. Neither has anyone she knows socially. Remember, Susan is a proud Boston native who has been a lifelong devoted supporter of Teddy Kennedy. (although I believe she’s currently employed in SoCal) She mentions Israel because, like Alan Dershowitz, her friend and colleague from Harvard, she’s part of the most conflicted group in politics – liberal Jews who are having to decide what they love more, Israel or Obama. For most of them, the answer is turning out to sadly be Obama. Which is exactly what Susan was signaling here – she’s willing to ignore Obama’s sellout of the Jewish Nation because one guy yelled out “you lie” at an inopportune time. Oh yeah, you sure were committed to your people, all right.
And THIS is the person who only decided to oppose Obama because of Joe Wilson? LOL!!!
WWS,
See I know I am not a racist and neither were the people there. I know Johnson is receiving hate mail and threats, which is turning him against his one time allies. From his view, given all the trash sent his way publicly and privately by Stacey McCain types, he rightfully see himself as under siege and threatened. And when no one defends him he can reasonably assume the silence is agreement with the trash talkers.
See WWS, I don’t react as a drama queen, I see the sad dynamics of small minded people attacking an ally over his differences of opinion.
Which is why I side with Johnson. I know what he is going through, and all his anger is the result of crap sent his way.
AJ,
How come I am not surprised you take the side of that creep, Johnson, who stabbed the conservatives bloggers in the back, and his lizardoids?
You are making a very bad mistake.
AJ,
Have you watched Glenn Beck recently? He presents facts and asks questions. Or do you just believe what the ‘Fringe’ media says and their lefty followers? He basically has nothing to do with the GOP, as the current GOP is part of the problem. America’s problem is currently a failure of 80% of the members in its current two party system to protect and defend the Constitution. One party is much worse than the other, but both fail miserably at upholding their oath of office. THAT is what needs to change. ‘Moderates’ are unable and/or unwilling to affect the kind of change that is necessary. It appears that ‘The People’ are beginning to handle it themselves. It will get ugly.
Thanks, Redteam, I thought that was correct. I had forgotten about Coulter’s book.
And ya know, regarding LGF and hatemail-there are viscious people all over America. But I prefer to believe they are the minority, not the majority.
I like Strata-Sphere, Rush, Glenn Beck, Gateway Pundit, Lucianne.com, David Horowitz, The Anchoress, Sean, O’Reilly (somewhat), Tammy Bruce, Sweetness-Light, Macsmind, Drudge, Brit Hume…So how am I to be labeled? And, do I agree with all of them all of the time: hell no. Laura Ingram, Malkin and Ann Coulter can be too strident for me but I listen to their points because they are often correct, imho.
Forgot AmericanThinker.com. Loooove them!
ivehadit,
I would label you seriously confused 😉