As you may know the members of the Watcher’s Council each nominate one of his or her own posts and one non-Council post for consideration by the whole Council. The complete list of this week’s Council nominations is here. The position on th…

Actually you have it wrong. The only thing that makes an illegal alien is they wanted the jobs that were being filled after the quota. The ‘line’ comment is a real nice sound bite – but that is not how it works. The line is for white collar, high tech jobs. The lower end jobs tend to have more need that people to fill them.

But the point is, it is all based on some mythical number someone made up in DC. If that number is increased to cover the number of people the economy could support (i.e., an applicant had a job in hand) then there would be no ‘line’ at the border. There would be lines at the job sites to get an opening.

But feel free to think a person is guilty because they are making a living and raising a family. Just don’t expect a lot of respect for it.

No, the one bothered to get in line to get the papers,the other did not.

Be that as it may the American Heritage Dictionary definition of Immigrate:

im·mi·grate (im’i-grat’)
Verb: im·mi·grat·ed, im·mi·grat·ing, im·mi·grates.
To enter and settle permanently in a foreign country.

So,by definition “guest workers” are NOT immigrants.

It follows then that if they want to be “immigrants” and then citizens of the US,they have to follow the procedures already set up to become citizens and swear allegiance to the US,and forswear allegiance to a foreign government.

“And for the immigrants that means major adjustments too.”

“The biggest complaint about immigration is the most accurate, immigrants represent an out of proportion drain on social services. Immigrants need accept this as a real problem and stop pretending everytime someone brings it up they are racist and xenophibic.”

Does that mean LaRaza and Mecha are out?

Now then, can anybody explain to me what is wrong with Pres. Bush’s plan?? As opposed to all the loud mouths in Congress who are just looking for free campaign airtime?And really do not care about changing the status quo anyway?

Actually I did respond in my post. I noted their were bad apples, but that means nothing.

Should I smear all Americans with Geofry Dahmer’s crime? I find the extremists on the other side fighting with the extremists on the conservative side the reason we have no solutions and the problem continues.

Yes, Tancredo and those anarchists on the pro immigration side are two sides of a bad penny in my opinion. Sorry that may pain people to hear. But there are some things I cannot support.

And then there are those really bad ideas I will fight to my dying days…..

You brought up where they send their money – so therefore you made something of it.

I am not against immigrants working if they pay their fare share. If you noticed what I wrote I specifically said that the underground nature of their work makes them rely on the socialist side of the programs.

You can post all you want – but I did not insult you. I disagreed totally with you. You keep leaning towards punishment, as if working and raising a family is wrong. You mix the bad apples with the good people and only see the bad apples.

You have no vision. You have recrimmination.

I’m afraid most people are not aware of the pro-illegal movements to which he refers.

Former Mexican President has been quoted as saying, “We will not tolerate foreign forces dictating and enacting laws on Mexicans [living in the United States].” This was around the time Prop 187 in CA was passed – and then rejected by the courts.

Mario Obledo…co-founder of MALDEF (Mexican American Legal Defense and Educational Fund), has been quoted as saying, “We’re going to take over all the political institutions in California. In five years the Hispanics are going to be the majority population of this state.” That was in 1998…and he was the former Secretary of Health and Welfare.

Another great quote – you are going to love this one! “Mexico is recovering the territories yielded to the United States by means of migratory tactics.” Elena Poniatowska, Mexican novelist

“We are practicing La Reconquista in California.”, General Jose Angel Pescador Osuna 2/6/98

“As goes the Latino population [s0] will go the state of California, and as goes the state of California [so] will go the United States of America. My friends, the stakes are big. This is a fight worth making.” Former Housing and Urban Development Secretary Henry Cisneros

When people read quotes such as these, they become angry and frightened. When they want to put a stop to it, they are labeled stupid or racist or worse.

Frist off, I made no assumption they want to be citizens and I would expect most would not. So you are starting off not understanding my position at all.

So what if most of the money goes back to their families out of country? Are you saying the government should dictate where we spend our money!

I agree they need to assimilate, and the only way to make that happen is to bring them out into the open. The point I was making is the underground nature of keeping workers illegal simply because some bureacrat in DC picked the number of guest workers we could support is INSANE! That number is meaningless. If people find a steady job and our unemployment rate is 5% then we all have to admit we absorb more guest workers and let these people apply.

This the stupidity of that dumbass number. There is no magic number of legal aliens every year. There are ebbs and flows in the capacity of work, mostly seasonal, where we simply need people to register and pay taxes when they find work!

I know the problem, you simply do not have a workable solution.

You can take a hike right off this site if you think I want anything to do with rounding up 11 million people because you can’t see any other solutions. Your lack of vision is not dictating my positions.

The arguments are that we need these workers. That if they are forced to leave it will be disaster for our economy and our work force. That is not true. The workforce will adjust just as it did when hiring children because against the law. Our economy did not crater then and it will not crater if we lose 11 million illegals. I hear the argument that the illegals take jobs that no other American will do. That also, is false. Two words: COAL MINER I have been in a position that I took a level entry job to help support my family. My pride left when I realized that if I didn’t, my family would not be fed.
And if you ask the average America if they were willing to pay more for services and goods and less in the taxes that it takes to support millions of illegals in our nation, what do you think the answer would be?
An illegal carpenter in Houston makes an average of $12.00 an hour. Do you really think there are no Americans that would work for that salary? Do you really think there are not high school kids who would be willing to cut our grass, or uneducated Americans who would be willing to work entry level positions? When was the last time you walked into a McDonald’s and everyone behind the counter was Spanish speaking only? Those were jobs that used to be held by Americans.
To compare those who want the illegals to go home to those who wanted the American-Japanese in interment camps is a low blow. The Japanese-Americans of 1943 were LEGAL. A surprisingly weak argument from you.
If illegals are only here to work, how do you explain the high number of illegals incarcerated in our prisons for crimes? In California alone, the estimate is as high as 50%. How do you explain the situation of the MS-13 that has become absolutely critical in our nation? Did those people just come here to work? How do you explain the over 72,000 illegals a year that are arrested in the United States on drug charges alone?
We need to start over.
We need to take away all social benefits from illegals. No public housing, no driver’s licenses, no AFDC and WIC.
We need to centralize our Social Security so that employers can check to make sure a number is legal and not like a friend of mine who found out that out of his 30 Mexican employees, 27 of them had SS numbers of dead people. Once we do that, we need to fine to the max, employers who knowing hire illegals.
Those two things in themselves will create a massive exodus back to Mexico. No benefits from the government, no jobs and they will leave because there will be no benefit to staying.
For those who do want to be here and work, if they are here illegally, they need to go to the back of the line for admission into the United States. There are plenty of people waiting to come that are willing to do it legally.
Do you really understand who is behind all the pro-illegal movements? Do you understand that it is LaRaza (the race, of course), the reconquistas who want to take back California, New Mexico, Arizona and Texas and give it to Mexico, the ANSWER Internation group, and other far left organizations that do not have the best interest of our nation at heart and would impose a Marxist form of government upon U.S. citizens? And do you understand that we, in the border states, have had it? That we are tired of being taxed do death to pay for education, medical treatment and other social benefits for illegals? Do you even realize that most Tejanos (Texas born of Hispanic ethnicity) do not want the illegals here?
Were the cities of Houston, Los Angeles, and others in worse shape before the Hispanic gangs like MS-13 arrived?
There are always going to be illegals. But they should know the consequences of their actions and there should be no “santuary” cities that protect them.
And one big problem we have no heard addressed; the Mexican government itself. Can you tell me why a nation that is the richest Spanish speaking nation in the world cannot support its own? Can you tell me why Vicente Fox is willing to dump his unwanted (because believe me, Fox does not want to have to take care of these people) on us? How many Mexican surgeons, lawyers, accountants, nurses, and other professionals are trying to sneak into the United States? How do you explain the fact that Fox has put his military on his southern border to keep out South Americans? He does not want immigrants but wants us to take his. What is wrong with that picture?
If anyone doubts the harm of unchecked immigration, one only has to look to France. Is that where we are heading? Small pockets of nations within a nation that does not honor the host nation’s laws or cultures? I can tell you the answer is yes.
And if poverty is the worry, what else are we doing but establishing a whole new segment of our society that will be damanding special treatment. The Hispanic poverty pimps are already out there. It is only a matter of time before they are asking for more than amnesty.