Aug 30 2011
Short Sighted Fools In DC
There is a rule on NASA missions that we can never design or implement a mission which relies on foreign resources to succeed or be safe. It has been a major barrier to international joint efforts forever because just about everything in a space mission is critical to its success. You can’t have a successful Hubble, for example, if you can’t get it into orbit, can’t communicate with it on a daily basis, can’t respond quickly to anomalies. We really don’t waste money on the systems (in most cases) at NASA over frivolous items. We do have serious problems with process and paperwork – which consumes over half the resources committed to a mission. We also have waste, abuse and fraud in isolated cases. But we make sure the core infrastructure is American and incapable of being compromised by other nations.
The norm is for a mission to be self sufficient in terms of US resources to operate within all expected and emergency scenarios. Until Obama, Pelosi and Reid took charge that is.
Now the International Space Station is incapable of being supported by American technology and resources. Not since the Democrat fools in the last Congress and this White House retired the space shuttle fleet AND ALSO cancelled the program to replace that fleet with another (cheaper) mode of transportation (i.e., the Orion program):
The Obama Administration’s proposed cancellation of the Constellation program in February 2010 and was signed into law October 11, [2010]
This job killing myopic act illustrates the clumsy, unthinking rashness of this White House and the last Congress. Apparently the President wanted Americans with shovels working, not exploring space and holding onto our technical edge in that final frontier of humanity. This White House is the first since Kennedy to halt America’s leadership in having people in space.
Now we see that we finished decades of investment and dangerous space walking work on the International Space Station just in time for Obama to force us to abandon it because of his short sightedness and – let’s be honest here – incompetence:
Astronauts may need to take the unprecedented step of temporarily abandoning the International Space Station if last week’s Russian launch accident prevents new crews from flying there this fall.
Until officials figure out what went wrong with Russia’s essential Soyuz rockets, there will be no way to launch any more astronauts before the current residents have to leave in mid-November.
As I said previously (see here, here and here), this has got to be the biggest screw up of all time. Last November humanity had just celebrated a continuous decade in space. Think about that – humanity’s first ever, continuous and long term presence off planet. And less than a year later – because the Democrats are a bunch of clueless, pretend know-it-alls – we have to abandon this outpost in space. Decades of work, billions of dollars spent, the sacrifice of lives and untold careers – and Obama throws it un-curiously away.
And this is helping our nation’s critical jobs and economic situation how again?
They say temporarily. It could turn into permanent. Right now, we have nothing and there’s push for halting the T and R work on Endeavour and Atlantis. And they should reverse the work on Discovery. But then we RIFF’ed a large group of people…will they come back? Who knows.
The response would be something like, “So-so is planning to launch something into space and within a few years, so-so is planning a manned launch.”
Yeah, right.
I wouldn’t rely on domestic resources that are full commercially developed either. After all, Progress and Soyuz (certain models) were built by Energia (used to be a government agency; now a private company, right?)
People need to stop listening to the likes of Rand Simpson as they’ve pushed for the wrong interim direction as well as the long term direction.
We went to “Salute the Shuttles” Tribute last Saturday night. Charles Bolden came up to the stage to give a speech…something about the history of the 30 year program. He wasn’t well-received by the audience. My husband and his brother had left to pick up the lawn chairs and missed his speech. I told him that it was timely for them to pick up the lawn chairs so that they can miss listening to him. My husband said, “Well, nobody’s listening to him anyway.” My husband has a network of very important people at various local companies and NASA so he knows what he’s talking about.
I see that Kay Bailey Hutchison is asking for not only Charles Bolden’s but also Lori Garver’s retirement. Good for her. Both of them need to leave.
November 2012 just cannot get here fast enough.
Next month is Obama’s jobs plan, which may end up as his last act prior to the SOTU before he becomes lame duck as 1 out of 4 democrats will vote for him at this point. Will the numbers improve? I doubt it.
I am not surprised. I read this yesterday. MSM’s not reporting it. How did this story break?
Then I read that Michelle Obama bought a Gibson guitar for Nicolas Sarkozy’s wife…that’s in spite of this Lacey Act. Good grief.
Hey, here’s an idea for shovel ready jobs. Restore our space program!
These are not shovel ready jobs.
OK AJ:
I love bashing Obama and the Dems as much as anyone but this fiasco is totally bipartisan. Bush is the guy that planned the cancellation of the shuttle program with no replacement. Bush is the guy that underfunded Orion so that there would be a 5-6 year gap in USA operational capability. Let’s face it. Even if Obama had come on board, kept Orion going, and gave it a 20% budget increase we’d still be waiting to 2014 or 2015 for the system to be operational. I blame Bush’s lack of vision and foresight as much as I blame Obama.
The only way this could have been avoided is if Bush and the Congress had ignored the Augustine Commission report, funded the Shuttle and Orion in parrallel, and maintained Shuttle capability until Orion was on line. I don’t recall anyone in the political arena advocating this approach. gutless cowards all.
So as much as it pains me AJ, you’re wrong to lay this at the feet of Obama and the Dems.
… solely at the feet of Obama and the Dems.
Layman – you are 100% Wrong! Bush initiated and funded the Orion project under the Constellation Program. The Shuttles needed to retire and their replacements were going to be ready in time until Obama was elected.
Now what do we have in 2012? Nothing. 2013? 2014? 2018? 2020?
Nothing!
I worked these programs – did you?
BTW, the problems with Orion were also mainly the fault of program management at JSC. They screwed up Altair but good, and then oversized and under priced Orion because Altair was in trouble in all sorts of ways. JSC had the same false start on Space Station Freedom. They needed to remember they had not designed and developed a vehicle since the Shuttle in the late 70’s. Station does not count – does not launch or land, though when I worked it I swore I could get training wheels on the damn thing without lifting a finger, but Lord help me if I had the get them off later!
Are you claiming Bush and NASA would not have extended Shuttles to cover the gap bewteen shuttle and CRV? Wow – a mind reader no doubt.
Constellation was supposed to have several space vehicles, starting with Apollo-like, then transititioning to something similar to the space shuttle but smaller. Constellation was supposed to develop several types of rockets.
Constellation budget ended up being spread out into more years. It wasn’t actually under-run but the JSC management style is typical government…slow and cumbersome process.
Bottom line is that NASA needed a shuttle replacement of its own with or without commercial space development.
There is nothing. Commercial space development’s accouncement of the availabiltiy of their own space vehicle will be met with as much hype as Irene’s.
Space travel is way too complext to be a reliable and repeatable machine. First accident of a commercial space vehicle? Liability insurance…small companies will be forced out of business. Big companies can absorb the massive liabilities.
I agree with AJStrata…Bush did cancel the shuttle program but made sure that something is in place of it. Obama canceled Constellation.
So yes, we are right to lay this at the feet of Obama and the Dems.
“There is nothing. Commercial space development’s accouncement of the availabiltiy of their own space vehicle will be met with as much hype as Irene’s.
Space travel is way too complext to be a reliable and repeatable machine. ”
So the rest of us are too ignorant to build rockets unless we work for NASA.
What would it take to resurrect the Orin/Constellation projects?
Why work can not continue, maybe with private funds?
How about partnership between Lockheed-Martin, Boeing and NASA?
Where there is a will there is a way.
Actually I did work on these programs. the constellation program consisted of the Orion capsule, the Ares I launcher, the Altair lander, the Ares V heavy launcher, the and the EDS (earth departure stage) for travel to the Moon and Mars.
Constellation was always underfunded and the NASA Authorization Act of 2005 (during Bush) doomed the program. The Augustine in 2009 commision noted that NASA would need an additional 2 – 2.5 billion a year for 5 years to have an ILC of 2014.
Look it up people – ILC of 2014. That means no Constellation now to get us to the ISS.
Congress (Teaxas and Florida reps) tried to get Shuttle funding extended to extend the program for 2-3 more launches taking us out to the end od 2012 or 2013 but it NEVER happened.
Please go look up the budgets. Bush’s last budget assumed we would need to buy rides from the Russians for three years. I’m not making htis up.
So yes, Obama cancelled Constellation with no backup and yes, Bush did kick off a new system but the huge cotroversy was that we’d have a manned capability gap. All you have to do is Google “Shuttle Extension Articles” and you’ll find stuff going back pre-Obama worrying about the planned gap between Shuttle and Orion.
By the way. SSMEs are avaivalble as are SRBs but there are no finished external tanks in stock (three partials are in storage). Unfortunately the tooling at Michoud has been mothballed, not to mention that the skilled labor force has been decimated.
It would take a huge amount of money and at least a year – more likely two – to get another shuttle off the ground.
http://www.space.com/6285-space-shuttle-extension-options-carry-high-costs.html
Here’s one from January 9, 2009 – before Obama was sworn in as El Jefe.
This guy from Big Government gets it: http://biggovernment.com/jmeath/2011/08/30/obama-administration-lost-in-space/
“So the rest of us are too ignorant to build rockets unless we work for NASA.”
Really?!?!?!?!?! So you’re very anti-NASA.
“What would it take to resurrect the Orin/Constellation projects?
Why work can not continue, maybe with private funds?
How about partnership between Lockheed-Martin, Boeing and NASA?
Where there is a will there is a way.”
We already have partnerships between Lockheed-Martin, Boeing, and NASA – USA and ULA.
The best way is to first get rid of Obama, Charles Bolden, and Lori Garver. Secondly, restore the mission statement of NASA back to the original mission statement.
“By the way. SSMEs are avaivalble as are SRBs but there are no finished external tanks in stock (three partials are in storage). Unfortunately the tooling at Michoud has been mothballed, not to mention that the skilled labor force has been decimated.
It would take a huge amount of money and at least a year – more likely two – to get another shuttle off the ground.”
That’s what I’m afraid of, which is why I think manned space exploration is already doomed. Even after Obama gets voted out of the office, it will take a very long time to restore and rebuild NASA. At least, NASA has, in recent times, been looking for ways to do things cheaper…like AGILE and technology advancement.
There are just as many debates over the types of rockets as there are in space vehicles.
BTW, I have no problems with full commercial space development as long as 1) NASA does not subsidize them. and 2) NASA continue to build its own space vehicles. Then NASA can use both its own and commercial space vehicles.
Liability insurance will doom many commercial space companies once a commercial space vehicle crashes.
Layman, at least Mike Griffin had the right hindsight to fight for the shuttle extension but by then Obama kicked him out and replaced him with the idiotic Charles Bolden, now so disliked by many in the NASA community.
Hahaha!
Did love the following comment from the BIG Government link:
“The position we find our selves in is a direct result of Obama’s complete lack of vision and intellectual vacancy! He frankly isn’t smart enough to understand the incredible benefits of a space program! But we can pay rocket scientists to help Muslims feel better about themselves. It’s absolutely pathetic.”
Bush was time limited so could not go beyond 2010 – budget wise so handed over the responsibility to Obama. It doesn’t matter what Bush did past 2010. What mattered was what Obama did. Obama did indeed have the lack of vision to extend the shuttle fleet until Constellation was able to replace the shuttle fleet.
We still lay the feet of Obama and the Dems for basically shutting down manned space exploration of NASA.
And, BTW, most of us do NOT work for NASA. Most of us work for private companies contracted to NASA.