Comments on: The Bush Conservatives

By: AJStrata

AJStrata — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 13:59:31 +0000

Ghost,

A Bush Conservative supports Bush over Reps – by definition. And there is a huge gap between criticism and undermining. You sound like the liberals with their version of ‘patriotism’!

By: Ghost Dansing

Ghost Dansing — Thu, 23 Nov 2006 02:02:25 +0000

I read the “Bush Conservative” manifesto… looks more like what some people “thought” Bush and this Republican administration was all about.

I do agree that modern Republicanism has been all about “hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil”… but that is not very American.

It is an American Citizens duty to criticize politicians and political parties, even if they are our own… maybe more so if they are your own.

Just maintaining the “Party Line”, as in this “11th commandment” thing is more like the Communist Party than any American political party.

By: FreeRepublicans.com

FreeRepublicans.com — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 06:55:18 +0000

The Problem of Bush…

More government is more government. The intent is not the issue, and claiming to have “big hearts” is a tact of the left….

By: For Enforcement

For Enforcement — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 04:49:05 +0000

Ken, thanks for the wrong side of that info, so we now know that the other side is the correct side. Being expert on British subjects, you are currently putting together a list, right?

By: retire05

retire05 — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 03:56:56 +0000

FE, as our federal government has failed us on immigration enforcement, municipalities and states are beginning to take action on their own. I think the Hazelton, Pa. rules have been put on hold by a Clinton appointed judge. Perhaps I could be wrong about that though. The Tx. rules are in a small town near Dallas that has been over run, Farmer’s Branch, I believe. Don’t you know the ACLU is already lawyering up? The ACLU has no greater love than that for pedophiles and illegals.
Arizona just passed a reform law on education rights for illegals as well as no bail for illegals.
Cities are having to raise taxes to bear the brunt of the addional cost of education for illegals. Towns are overburdened by additional services. There is just so much any municipality can afford. The town next to me is sizable in that the student body was probably about 8,000 two years ago. Since it is within commuting distance of Austin, it has seen over 1,000 additional students in the last two years just from illegals. This has required the hiring of teachers who can teach English as a second language classes as well as tutors to bring these children up to grade level. Property taxes have skyrocketed to pay for the additional teachers, class rooms, tutors not to mention these children receive breakfast and lunch, all at no cost to the parents.
I had to take a senior lady to the welfare office. No one in the waiting room spoke English and it was full. A HHS worker came out and asked “does anyone here speak English?” and only the lady I took raised her hand.
Two years ago, I was in Rogers, Arkansas. I had to go to Wal-mart and all the signs in the store there were in Spanish. The illegals work for Tysons, Paul’s and other poultry plants and have literally put families out of work because Tyson can hire them for less money.

Look, I would love to be able to say “come on in” to every person that wants to come and start a new life. But we cannot take all of the oppressed and poor of the world. And places like Hazelton and Farmer’s Branch are finding that out.
What do I think? I think Hazelton and Farmer’s Branch will start a trend that will go all across the nation. If the feds won’t enforce the laws, communities will.

By: Ken

Ken — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 03:45:28 +0000

Strata says the Buchananan & “fence only” crowd has no chance of ever becoming pivotal in politics again. By this I suppose he means the “fence only” and “get tough on employers” symbiotic crowd too. But he might be surprised at the kind of parties that will develop with enough deterioration of the kind his milquetoast strata-gy will
facilitate. For instruction I reccommend obtaining a quick history of the BNP/ British National Party in England, which was once written out of polite UK politics.

By: For Enforcement

For Enforcement — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 03:36:01 +0000

RetireO5,, what do you think of what they did in Hazelton, Pa. I think other cities are beginning to do the same thing. One in Tx, one in Ga. I think I’ve heard of some others. They did the story on 60 minutes tonight. Very interesting.

By: retire05

retire05 — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 01:34:30 +0000

AJ, thank you for your answer. And so much for your “compromise”. I understand now. I must agree to allow all those who have entered our nation illegally to remain here, give them a guest worker visa and accept that you think that is the will of the people. Funny, it seems the whole state of Arizona disagrees with you. You, AJ, are the hardliner. You prove that with your refusal to answer my questions or to debate the issue. Your way or the highway. I fully understand. And since I believe you are for stem cell research, I can then accept the fact that you believe in killing human embryos for research, as well. Because the argument is really black and white, isn’t it? You are either for stem cell research allowing the killing of embryos or you are against stem cell research and not the killing of embryos.
Arizona election results:
No bail for illegal immigrants: 78% for – 22% against
English as state language: 74.1 for – 25.9 against
Limited education services for illegal immigrants: 71.5% for – 28.5 against
John Kyl (an enforcement first proponent) won by 150,000 votes with three other candidates splitting the vote against Kyl.
Arizona is a heavily Republican state. But then, I guess you will not accept that many Republicans, who back our president on all other issues, do not agree with him on immigration. With your recent posts, it seems that this is just short of treason in your opinion.
You don’t want compromise, AJ. You want your way. You want your opinion imposed on those of us who pay the highest cost for illegal immigration. I understand. Not living in a border state (and don’t tell me how many illegals you have in your state, you can’t hold a candle to Texas, New Mexico and Arizona), I fully understand that illegal immigration is the problem relegated to the southwestern states and really has little impact on you. How many illegal children is in your kid’s school? 5%? 10%? But then, I am sure that when your school taxes triple to cover the cost of 50+% illegals in your schools, you will have no problem with that.
I do not agree with everything George Bush has done. That is the beauty of being an American, AJ. I don’t have to. I voted for Bush because I thought he would be fiscally responsible. He was not. But he was better than Gore. I campaigned hard for him again in 04. Not because of his fiscal responsibility but because I knew he understands the threat that Muslim radicals pose. I knew he would be tough on terrorism and would do everything he could to protect our nation from another attack.
Do you agree with everything your wife says? Or do you threaten to leave her if she doesn’t agree with you? That is what you want. Total agreement. No argument. No other side of the coin. No understanding how illegal immigration affects the rest of the nation beside you little corner of it.
You say you are not a Republican. Perhaps your Democratic ways are just too hard to throw off. I have no idea. But you are no conservative when it comes to illegal immigration and at least be truthful and admit that. Perhaps then we can move on to other issues that we do agree on. But blind allegiance to any president (or any politician for that matter) will not be one of them.

By: AJStrata

AJStrata — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 00:38:37 +0000

Retire,

Because you don’t back a guest worker program that assimilates all the folks here already. Your distinction is meaningless and the positions you espouse damage conservative causes at the expense of a few hardliners. 60-75% of the country are against your positions. You can include me in that majority.

By: retire05

retire05 — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 23:44:37 +0000

AJ, please, tell me why you insist on saying that I am a “fence only” proponent when I have repeatedly told you that I am “fence first”. Is that if you admit that there are other aspects to immigration reform that you might feel you are losing ground?
I believe in a fence. Fences make good neighbors. They also allow control over who does and who does not enter your property.
Yes, I believe in a guest worker program. I think that we should allow those we need to enter legally and work on a permit for a certain length of time. Then they should return to their native country. If during the time they are guest workers, they want to apply for citizenship, with proper documentation and background checks, they should be allowed to do so.
Yes, I believe in immigration. Immigration should be for the purpose of benefit to the host nation, not to the immigrant.
No, I don’t think that illegals should go unpunished when they steal someone’s social security number, as they have mine. Along with my credit card number.
No, I don’t think illegals should be rewarded simply because they managed to stay in the U.S., without being deported, long enough to get amnesty.
If I decide to pitch a tent and live in your back yard, would you not have a problem with that?
So please, drop the “fence only” b/s. It is old. And see if you can find your way to answering some of my questions. I can only think that you know the answers are not what you “amnesty under any other name” proponents want to accept.

By: AJStrata

AJStrata — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:52:01 +0000

BTW, it is not an insult to say your position will never get my support. Sorry, but that is just a statement of my position and how I see the Fence Only crowd. You folks need to deal with your new found irrelevancy. All or nothing on Guest Worker program? Nothing then.

By: AJStrata

AJStrata — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:50:32 +0000

Retire05,

I made very clear your refusal to support the guest worker program landed you in the Fence Only crowd and now irrelevant. This issue is not debatle anymore. We don’t need any more help from the Fence Only crowd in losing ground and elections. Thanks – but no thanks.

By: retire05

retire05 — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:20:11 +0000

LNDANTEXAS, yes the Coast Guard patrols our waterway. Not just in Florida but in Texas, Mississippi, Louisiana, Georgia and ever other coastal state. But the Border Patrol does not just operate in the states that border Mexico. They also function in the above states as well as those that border Canada. And please, don’t show your ignorance by indicating that Alabamians are being kept out of Florida by Border Patrol. The BP does not patrol state lines.

No, Hispanics, on a local level, did not vote Republican in 04, only on a nation level. So you, once again, show you have no grasp of the Hispanic vote. Since there was no presidential election, we really did not lose what we never had in the first place. In 04, Hispanics, on a local level, voted Democrat, just as they have always traditionally done.

I am a fence first proponent. Stop the leak in the boat before you worry about how you are going to get to shore.

There are those of you who would like to blame the losses in the past election on immigration. That simply is not true. It was due to a number of things, one being that traditionally, the party in control loses seats during a mid term election. And the bottom line? We did not lose as badly as we could have.
Perhaps you and AJ would like to explain to me, using your theories, why Kyl won in Arizona? And why did all those inititives on the ballot stopping benefits to illegals win?
The reason I asked about Austin is because you sound like an Austin Republican. Not an insult. I don’t have to resort to insults. It was just an observation.

By: retire05

retire05 — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:05:15 +0000

One other thing, AJ, you asked me if I would support a guest worker program. Yes or no. I made it very clear that it was a gray question and deserved a grey answer. Yes, and no. But that was not good enough for you. You wanted a one word answer. I either supported a guest worker program for those all ready here illegally or I could not possible support the guest worker program.
Again, I SUPPORT A GUEST WORKER PROGRAM FOR THOSE WHO ENTER OUR NATION LEGALLY.
Now, where is all that compromise you are always spouting about? Or is it just more of the “my way or the highway” from you?

By: retire05

retire05 — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:00:00 +0000

AJ, lost cause? Why do you feel the need to insult me when I have not stooped to insulting you?
I have asked you question after question about the detriments of amnesty (and yes, that is what you are advocating) and you refuse to answer. Instead, I get more insults.
This, IMO, makes you less than honorable. But it does make you pigheaded. Your way or the highway mentality. You refuse to discuss the issues I have posed, you direct your response to me by addressing someone else’s post so that you can, once again, insult me.

Because I do not agree with Bush on immigration does not mean that I am anti-Bush. What it does mean is that I am an independent thinker who does not march lock step to any mantra.

I could stop posting here but you would count that as a coup and think that you have won the argument. You, by your silence on my questions, have won nothing, have not proven your argument for amnesty and have confirmed that you are not an independent thinker, just a dependent follower of those who disagree with the President on one issue.
Tell me, AJ, did your city ever managed to move out all those poor illegal migrants that were violating your city rental codes? Or did you just decide that having 20 people in a 2 bedroom apartment is none of your business?