Dec 08 2006
Strange Report On Poisoned Cup
This seems a bit wierd and doesn’t explain much of the contamination.
Meta
-
Recent Posts
- Farewell AJ – RIP
- More Rice Lies [Just Another Inspector Clouseau]
- Susan Rice, Obama’s Dirty Surveillance Rat
- DNC’s Russian Hack NOT Investigated By FBI – But By DNC Contractor
- Situation Normal, All Farkased Up
- Congress Wants Evidence On Illegal Surveillance – Here It Is!
- About That Infamous “Trump Server”
- NY Times’ Orwellian Rewrite Of History
- Obama’s Surveillance Of Team Trump: A Probable Paper Trail
- Judge Napolitano Confirms Obama Could Order Surveillance On US Persons
A1 News Sites
Blogroll
- Ace Of Spades HQ
- Air Vent
- Bishop Hill
- Bookworm Room
- Climate Audit
- Conservatives 4 Palin
- Election Projection
- FiveThirtyEight – Nate Silver
- Flopping Aces
- Gates of Vienna
- Gateway Pundit
- Hot Air
- Hyscience
- Ice Cap
- Instapundit
- JammieWearingFool
- JoNova
- Judith Curry
- JustOneMinute
- Long War Journal
- Michael J Totten
- Michael Yon
- Pirate's Cove
- QandO
- Sister Toldjah
- Small Dead Animals
- The American Thinker
- The Jawa Report
- Threats Watch
- Watts Up With That?
Communities
Former Watcher of Weasels
Categories
- AJStrata's GUT
- All General Discussions
- 2006 Elections
- 2008 Elections
- 2010 Elections
- 2012 Elections
- 2013 Fiscal Cliff
- 2014 Elections
- 2016 Elections
- 24, Season 6
- Able Danger/9-11
- Anti War Protests
- Bin Laden/GWOT
- Brexit
- Chicago-Way Corruption Scandal
- DHS-Rightwing Extremists
- Downing Street Memos
- Eminent Domain/Kelo
- EU Constitution
- Filibuster Showdown
- FISA-NSA
- Foleygate
- GITMO-Durbin
- Global Warming
- Illegal Immigration
- Katrina
- Leak Investigations
- Litvinenko, Berezovsky, Chechens
- MAGA
- Measuring The Recovery
- Obama and FISA
- Obama's War In Libya
- Obamacare
- Plame Game
- Reid's Land Deals
- ShutdownTheater/Barrycades
- Solyndra Scandal
- Stem Cell Debate
- The Trump Presidency
- Trayvon Martin Case
- VA Scandal
- VA Tech Massacre
- Carnival Of The Clueless
- Fly By
- Guest Bloggers
- Orlando Massacre
- Raging RINOs
- The Duh! Files
- Watchers Council
Archives
- April 2018
- April 2017
- March 2017
- January 2017
- December 2016
- November 2016
- October 2016
- September 2016
- August 2016
- July 2016
- June 2016
- May 2016
- March 2015
- February 2015
- December 2014
- November 2014
- October 2014
- September 2014
- August 2014
- July 2014
- June 2014
- May 2014
- April 2014
- March 2014
- February 2014
- December 2013
- November 2013
- October 2013
- September 2013
- August 2013
- July 2013
- June 2013
- May 2013
- April 2013
- March 2013
- February 2013
- January 2013
- December 2012
- November 2012
- October 2012
- September 2012
- August 2012
- July 2012
- June 2012
- May 2012
- April 2012
- March 2012
- February 2012
- January 2012
- December 2011
- November 2011
- October 2011
- September 2011
- August 2011
- July 2011
- June 2011
- May 2011
- April 2011
- March 2011
- February 2011
- January 2011
- December 2010
- November 2010
- October 2010
- September 2010
- August 2010
- July 2010
- June 2010
- May 2010
- April 2010
- March 2010
- February 2010
- January 2010
- December 2009
- November 2009
- October 2009
- September 2009
- August 2009
- July 2009
- June 2009
- May 2009
- April 2009
- March 2009
- February 2009
- January 2009
- December 2008
- November 2008
- October 2008
- September 2008
- August 2008
- July 2008
- June 2008
- May 2008
- April 2008
- March 2008
- February 2008
- January 2008
- December 2007
- November 2007
- October 2007
- September 2007
- August 2007
- July 2007
- June 2007
- May 2007
- April 2007
- March 2007
- February 2007
- January 2007
- December 2006
- November 2006
- October 2006
- September 2006
- August 2006
- July 2006
- June 2006
- May 2006
- April 2006
- March 2006
- February 2006
- January 2006
- December 2005
- November 2005
- October 2005
- September 2005
- August 2005
- July 2005
- June 2005
- May 2005
-
-
Strata-sphere Calendar
December 2024 S M T W T F S « Apr 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 Post Tags
9-11 2008 Election 2010 election 2010 Elections 2016 Election Afghanistan al-Qaeda Bush CIA Climategate Clinton Congress CRU Democrats Economic Crisis Economy FATA FISA Flight 253 Ft Hood Massacre Global Warming GOP Holder IPCC Iran Iraq Liberals McCain NSA Obama Obamacare Pakistan Palin Pelosi Poll Polls President Obama Sarah Palin Scott Brown Stimulus Bill Taliban Tea Party Trump Unemployment Victory
Hmmm. I wondered – Is it possible that the assassin posed as a Millenium employee? Have all the M employees been accounted for? No rumors of a “missing” employee? That could explain their exposure – he/she stepped behind the bar, dropped the PO210 in the “cup”, maybe a little sloshing here and there, other employees clean it up and the assassin went on their merry little way.
It could have been done right at the table. Ever seen a fancy card dealer or other “slight of hand” specialist? Doesn’t take much but to have a little hobby in magic.
Interesting possibility, Enlightened. As I recall the Times report, UK authorities believe the poison cocktail was mixed in one of the hotel’s hotel rooms, the assassin tried to administer it to Litvinenko at the sushi restaurant, failed, and then gave it to him at the hotel.
At the hotel, one report is that he drank only tea. Another that he had vodka.
At the sushi bar, I don’t recall exactly but I believe he had soup and maybe tea.
Is is possible the tea bag contained PO or if loose tea, the leaves were dipped in PO? Do the police believe this because the “spill” in the hotel room contained some traces of tea?
Would have to be multiple assassins. Doesnt make sense. For it to be an employee of the pine bar, someone would have had to know he would be at the pine bar. Getting someone situation as an emplooyee of a hotel working in just the right spot takes considerable advance work, not something done “off the cuff”.
Doesn’t explain how Scaramella got such a huge dose inside him without getting any on him either.
One thing that strikes me is that it must be a pretty huge bar for 7 employees to be contaminated there. Some reports say that it’s 7 employees at the Milennium hotel, some say that they worked specifically in the bar. If Po-210 got loose in the hotel room, any person cleaning there would be contaminated, and it is also possible people in the hotel could pick it up through the ventilation system. The latter, fortunately, doesn’t appear to be the case, since it does not explain why it’s only Milennium hotel employees, and not visitors, who are showing signs of contamination.
We don’t know how much Scaramella ingested do we?
As for Russia wouldn’t dare–Try KAL airline as just one example when they in fact did dare.
For those who believe that this was an assassination, I have a question: Of all the ways to kill someone, why with polonium? Why such an exotic means of poisoning? I’m just seeking you opinion mind you. I know it would be impossible for you to actually determine their thinking behind why. I just want to know what reasons would be acceptable for you to rule out all other methods of assassination and all other poisons and substances. You may have already answered this in another post, but please forgive me for not keeping up with everything written on this subject!
They haven’t tested visitors yet. They just issued a call to 200 people today to come in and be tested. If the Russian govt. did this and contaminated hundreds of people, there are going to be some serious consequences to pay. The people will demand it. That’s why I don’t think they did it. WAY too risky.
Try to answer with as much in consideration as possible (eg cost, availability, transportation, know-how, ease, set-up, traceability, probability of success, etc.)
You only use polonium if you don’t want the poison to be detected and want symptoms to appear weeks after the lethal dose is delivered.
Which is why 50-100x the lethal dose so that symptoms appear the same day and a persons steps can easily be retraced and all this talk of contaminating other people to throw investigators off the trail makes no sense.
You use polonium for stealth if you are going to use it as a poison, but it is pretty much like using a gold bar as a doorstop. There are better, less dangerous things to use as a poison that are just as effective.
Every single piece of this puzzle has smuggling ring, accidental release, pisoning to cover up written all over it. I dont doubt Litvinenko was poisoned. I just don’t think the Russian government did it. I believe either Lugovoi or Scaramella did it.
Which is also apparently what Livinenko believed according to news reports.
Also, for the assassination theorists, is there any way the assassin could have done all that you believe him to have done without himself being contaminated and eventually dead from radiation? I am not asking if we would ever know that the assassin is dead; I only want to know if you believe it to be possible for him to be so careful so as to not contaminate himself.
WoG, I don’t think the assassination story is the most likely, but I can think of a few reasons to kill someone with Po-210.
1) One would be to state an example (this is the most obvious) and scare opponents. Power demonstration.
2) Another would be to make sure people suspect Russians.
3) Demonstrate the effects of Po-210 to the public (something that a terrorist organization would be interested in doing, although it is unclear why it would be demonstrated on Russian spies).
4) The most unpleasant, as well as most unlikely, reason is if it is an assassination and terrorist attack in one.
Lost …
WRT #1 You would only do that if you KNEW it would be detected as polonium. The only time you would use polonium is when you are pretty sure it WOULDN”T be detected.
Russia wouldn’t use polonium like this because now every terrorist in the world knows about it. We are going to see every terrorist in the world trying to make/get their hands on this stuff for decades.
If this is a hit by the Russians, it is so totally stupid on so many different levels that Russia doesn’t deserve to have either a nuclear program or an intelligence service. This would be pure stupidity. If Putin did this, his own people would have him tossed out in the street on his rear end. Russia isn’t THAT stupid.
If you think it possible for him/her to avoid contamination, then it would require a lot of training and know how when dealing with polonium. But that would seem to run contrary with the way this stuff has been spread all over London. For if he knew how to keep himself safe then he should be able to manage covering his steps.
This being the case, it would seem that the assassin would fall into two categories:
1) He was a smart assassin, who knew his stuff and knew his poison, and knew that there was no way for him to escape it himself. This, then, means that he was on a potential suicide mission.
2) He was a dumb, bungling assassin, who knew nothing about the stuff (how it spread, how deadly, how traceable, etc.) only that it was “poison.”
which do you think he was? Or is there a third possibility? Also I recognize that I am assume a single assassin. Adding more people can answer some questions, but it also raises new questions.
The bartenders handled the drink?
WHO the victims are? Lining up dead, or sick. Or contaminated.
But the HOW. Even if you find the “cup” that did it. HOW did so many places get contaminated?
Russia is notorious for POOR QUALITY CONTROLS. That’s why there was Chernobyl. Wouldn’t it be ironic, if the “HOW’ was a maintenance problem? Or carelessness? Or just idiots handling poisons. But they didn’t know they were dangerous at all?
$50-million in product. Isn’t something you pour into a drink.
Multiple trips? Ditto.
Is it possible that Litvenenko KEPT getting dosed? Did he have a favorite bottle of vodka, he shared with the barmen? And, someone slipped “one mickey” inside?
HOW would something like this get designed? Long before it comes “off” the drawing board. It is cooked up.
While the Black Marketeers? They’ve been in business for years and years. What pushes open the envelope?
I know some have said this just shows the “brilliance” of putin. But if you’re going to do “murder for hire” do you do it in stages? With poisons that take time to progress? Wouldn’t “mistakes” be more likely?
And, if it’s “mistakes” … why think putin caused them? And, not human stupidity.
Heck, Polonium killed Madame Courie. And, she wasn’t stupid. Just so totally unaware. And, she loved showing off the X-Ray pictures of the bones inside people.
Well? Science has discoveries that come out of confounding mistakes? Why not something that went wrong?
Since I don’t know HOW you transport Polonium. I have no idea if the vehicle couldn’t be simple bottles of Vodka. Disguised so well, Litvenenko didn’t know the “dummy” from the real thing?
Why wasn’t Litvenenko’s body allowed inside the mosque for his funeral? If the Imam said he was afraid of poisoning the congregation, what did he mean?
And, future transports? Terrorists who have successfully breached security, want to scuttle this? I find that absurd.
Notice that no-one picked up on Channel 4 news report (see video) on the supposed fatal cup which then contaminated the Millenium dishwasher and sparked fears of contamination of the water supply.