Jan 12 2007

Shvets Was In London, Is Polonium In America?

Published by at 12:48 am under All General Discussions

Update: I am really wondering about the reporting on this article, which was repeated in many news outlets. The earlier reporting had Shvets claiming Litvinenko told Shvets about the incident (making Tempester’s comment below correct):

“Litvinenko told me he met Lugovoy and other Russians and they offered him tea that wasn’t made in front of him, said Shvets.

Now this version clearly sounds like Shvets is being told after the fact by Litvinenko. So what to make of it? In the light of day, not in a hurry to get off the computer, I would say we need to have some supporting evidence before buying into this one. – end update

Why is it we are just learning now that Yuri Shvets left the US to meet Litvinenko in London on November 1st:

An associate of Litvinenko, Yuri Shvets, told the BBC last month that he had drunk tea with two Russians on November 1 at the Pine Bar of the Millennium Hotel, where British tests show eight staff and two guests received doses above six mSv.

This is completely unacceptable. I live in Virginia where Shvets is located. And to find out now he was at the Millenium hotel witjh Lugovoi and Kovtun and Litvinenko and around the Po-210 trail is just disturbing. Why is it the news media cannot report that someone linked to Po-210 was present at the site of the deadliest Po-210 poisoning ever recorded in history? Who is the media trying to protect? I reported here that the Po-210 trail might lead to the US – and now it does! But no news. I reported here where the US was the country with the most P0-210 lost and stolen – and still the media ignores it. Is Po-210 in America? It would seem so. Why is this not news? Since when did someone in the US being directly tied to the smuggling of nuclear material in the UK which killed someone and poisoned 120+ people not make headlines?

19 responses so far

19 Responses to “Shvets Was In London, Is Polonium In America?”

  1. tempester says:

    I think that the way this article is written is misleading – I think it means that Litvinenko had tea with two russians.

  2. Lizarde1 says:

    I agree – it says “had tea with 2 Russians” – in all there were 3 Russians – Litv. &Kov & Lug – not Shevts &Lit & Lug. – that math would leave out Kovtun. This is really poorly written and I understand how one would think that Shevts was sitting in the Pine Bar Nov. 1

  3. pentole.coperchi says:

    I’m Italian.
    Would yust like to suggest you to take in due notice the coincidence of the presence of Mr. Scaramella in London on the first.
    I do not think it was yust a case.
    You probably know that “La Repubblica” had wrote an article on Mitrokhin Commission based upon an interviev with Mr. Limarev exactly on the very next day of the “London case of posoning”. Well today it has come out that that article was written on 2005 (I am shure you inderstand what that could mean) and Mr. Limarev has yust denied to have told to those people most of the things they wrote, particularly about Mr. Guzzanti.
    I would like you to visit the site of Mr. Paolo Gussanti: http://www.paologuzzanti.it (unfortunately it is in italian).
    I have been reading all your articles about this matter and think you are working pretty well, this is the reason why now I post right here.
    Hope my horrible english will result enough clear.

  4. AJStrata says:

    Pentole,

    Graci (that’s it for my italian!). I will look into Limarev and Scaramella more. I understand his involvement may be much deeper. I do not understand what is important about 2005 – could you help me?

    AJStrata

  5. Carol_Herman says:

    IF Oswald could have been killed prior to 11/22/63, there’s no way the “plan to kill Kennedy” could have come off. PERIOD.

    But we were naive in those days.

    Today’s espionage; and counter-espionage is more PRO-ACTIVE.

    And, while the arabs chatter a lot! We now know that they were chattering for years about how they’d “get” commercial aircraft to work as their bombs. We just ignored it. Par for the OLD course.

    Not the new stuff, though.

    And, Turki, the HOUSE OF SAUD’s ambassador to DC, had to skedadal out of DC in one heck of a hurry. That spoke volumes on “missing the diplomatic transfer” out of an ambassador.

    Yes, the HOUSE OF SAUD would have loved to disrupt out government. And, what better chance did they have than the upcoming State of the Union Address? (Seems getting things into Congress is easier than planting stuff in the White House. And, what other even brings the President and the veep together in one room?) It would have been a hell of an ending! No noises. Just collapses, occurring after the fact. Almost without fingerprints.

    Except that there’s always the chatter. Because the arabs have to hire out for everything on their wish lists.

    We. Will. Never. KNOW!

    No one is going to go into the details. Even as to “what went wrong.”

    Interesting, however, how the Goldfarb PR campaign claiming this was an assassination attempt, has bitten the dust.

    It comes down to “motivations.” While, I’m sure, during Litvinenko’s hospitalization, all sorts of things were told to him about “recovery.” As he probably believed he’d live longer than he did. And, he’d be a candiate for a bone marrow transplant. Or whatever else was promised.

    Which could me there were people disguised as doctors, who, in fact, had sophisticated credentials, as well. Who got to look at Litvinenko’s records, while he was hospitalized. You got to wonder, too, if anyone ended up with some of the hairs that fell out of his head? Or toenail clippings.

    And, since the imam at the mosque in Londonstan was TERRIFIED about being radiated, who knows? It would be an interesting way to rid communities of terrorists’ mosques. Just by delivering IN some garbage. By the time some of the arabs figure things out, you could say a number within their community, left standing; would begin to flee.

    And, up ahead, putting bad guys on the run is definitely a workable plan.

    While the money people are no longer holding onto the evidence.

    Bet this operation got closed down; once the cat flew out of da bag.

  6. pentole.coperchi says:

    I was speaking of 2005 meaning that tose people of “la Repubblica” had interviewed Mr. Limarev on 2005 but published the article only when the question “Scaramella Poisoned” come out (late 2006). Notice that nobody in Italy had ever heard his name before that happening. He was not a person of interest for anybody despite maybe someone he was investigating about or someone who wanted to discredit Mr. Guzzanti.
    Limarev, yesterday, under Mr. Guzzanti pressure who met him at “Les 4c” hotel at Cluses (french Savoy), had to admit (on the record) that what “La Repubblica” wrote was not what he told them.
    Besides I might try to translate some of the most important articles published by Mr. Guzzanti on Italian press but, as you see, my english is not so good and you might even not rely me.
    At now Scaramella is in prison and cannot speak with nobody because considered dangeurous. We still not have understood what kind of crime he has committed. Notice that nobody is saying he was the most relyable of the persons but the question is not on this point. The point is: why is he in prison under top-surveillance and cannot speak with nobody but his attorney??.
    Many thanks

  7. Carol_Herman says:

    When John F. Kennedy’s brains were blown out in Dallas, that was a committed crime.

    But what have you got here? Nothing got “committed.” People don’t even know “what leaked.” If it was in liquid form. Powder. Or “flakes.” And, no one has any idea HOW it was gonna get used. Because the plot didn’t get that far along.

    But “something happened.” Was it like Chernobyl? An accident caused by inneficiency? The russians have great science up to a point. And, then disaster strikes. Because they have no management skills.

    You then couple the HOUSE OF SAUD to all of this stuff. And, you begin to realize that terrorism was put into place when the Wahhabi’s took over ALL the mosques around the world! Something that had been “mom and pop.” Country by country. Found that money pushed in imams based on raising holy hell.

    It was here. Among this chatter. That there were discussions preceeding 9/11, that had to do with aircraft. And, how the West was asleep, when it came to “handling” hijacks. If this weren’t true, the crew would have reacted differently. And, hijackers wouldn’t have been so swift as seeing themselves lauded as heroes. Heck, the PLO got to a point where even President Bush says some of these terrorists not only deserve a state; until they get one, there are “no solutions to the arab problems.”

    And, since Litvinenko is dead. And, others are exposed to the smuggled good he, and others, were carting around; what can you do?

    You could assume you hear the truth from the press. And, Goldfarb immediately spun out the story of an assassination.

    But Scaramella is not in prison for “assassinating” Litvinenko! He was just a handy “useful idiot.” Who had come from italy to play with the bad guys.

    As to the crime that was gonna be committed? Nobody knows fer shur what had been planned.

    And, then? Nobody asks how many people could have been killed by the release of radioactive materials. If you use Chernobyl as an example, you see a city where no one can live safely. Will this be true in 10,000 years? And, who’d care? Because you can’t live there, now.

    What would happen to the English monarchy if London became uninhabitable?

    Not talking science. Because Heroshima and Nagasaki are cities that were hit. Chernobyl, however, is still radioactive.

    Chernobyl’s troubles weren’t caused by a bomb, either.

    Could it have been planned to damage DC to the point where America wouldn’t have leadership? And, what would happen if such a calamity occurred? Who’d be in charge? Haig?

  8. reliapundit says:

    lugovoi and kovtun went BACK to putin’s russia for treatement.

    or to use treatment as a cover.

    therefore they MUST work for putin.

    the polonium did not cost the kgb a penny out-of-pocket, so they may consider it a FREE way to kill someone and send a message.

    and if the assassins got little contaminated, so what – it removes a little suspicion.

  9. Lizarde1 says:

    Petole – your English is good enough to understand – don’t worry about it – just post and we’ll understand – that is really really interesting that Scaramella is considered dangerous and nobody can talk to him – could this have to do with stuff they found on his computer and in his papers that they took from his house and office because he “violated waste disposal” rules. Could he have been part of the smuggling business? Keep reading the Italian papers and let us know anything interesting.

  10. pentole.coperchi says:

    AJ,
    my name is Simona (pentole.coperchi is yust a pun upon an Italian proverb).
    I understand your interest on the all question is more focalised on international politics than strictly on Italian internal tensions:
    therefore I will try to circumscribe my arguments.

    Well, you Know what Italian press says about Scaramella:
    He worked for the Mithokhin commission and was a boaster. He provided false credentials. And is probably a silly man quite unreliable who has casually been involved in the London question.

    This “poor man of no value” is in prison under strict surveillance!! Accused of (for the moment):
    1) CONTINUATIVE DEFAMATION. Against whom? An Ukrainian guy named Talik (ex KGB agent) that Scaramella had accused of terrorism. This man was judged guilty in Italy and convicted some years ago, he still is in prison. Talik has not yet made (notice!) personally any accusation against Mr. Scaramella.
    2) Two days ago the magistrates added the imputation of having forged a “FALSE DOSSIER” against Mr. Prodi and other people. The dossier the magistrates are speaking of has been passed integrally to “La Repubblica” I suppose by the investigating pool!!
    It was published two days ago.

    I have read the document they call “dossier” and found it of scarce interest and improbable utility, chiefly because in all the document no “proves” are cited of what Scaramella writes in there. It looks much pretty like some notes taken for personal purposes. Among the people cited in the “dossier” there are also the two journalists of La Repubblica that published on late 2006 the now taken back interview with Limarev.
    In that interview Limarev asserted that he had visited Italian secret services locations in company of Scaramella, that he had personally met with Mr. Guzzanti and that he had been made subscribe declarations he had no way to check because written in Italian!!!
    Now he denies, directly to Senator Guzzanti, of having told to those journalists that he subscribed any document, to have been carried in secret services locations and asserts that he now believes to have been introduced by Scaramella with a man who had disguised himself as Mr. Guzzanti (I have serious doubts he is saying all the truth): “now that I see you personally Senator, I am shure the person I was introduced to it was not you”. He also says that on 2005 he was payied to make those declarations.
    Please note that the Judges, as far as I know, move no accuse to Scaramella for having used illegally the file material he had on his PC (seized in his home because of a search-warrant emitted, when he still was in London, relatively to crimes linked to violation of waste disposal rules).

    All the critics about the Mitrokhin commission and his president Mr. Guzzanti come out the very next day Litvinenko got poisoned and the most important daily papers in Italy started up a defamatory campaign against the Mitrokhin Commission and its results which continues still now.
    Those two judges who imprisoned Scaramella have made no mystery in the past of their sympathy for the Italian left parties (anyway, this does not mean they are working in bad faith).

    Mr. Gordievsky has declared “on the record” that there were some Russian people in London waiting to make “things happen” on the date of the arrival of Mr. Scaramella.

    Whom shell we believe?

    I find that your theory about smuggling accident is quite interesting but the fact that PO-210 was in London a least since the 16th October made me ponder on Gordievskji declarations.
    Even though Scaramella might come out to be the doubtful figure they are picturing, why are people in Italy using such determination trying to demonstrate he was not involved in the Litvinenko poisoning while all the rest of the world gives him few notice and consider him not involved as well?

    Simona

  11. pentole.coperchi says:

    P.S. : And why an explosive interview was not published for one year?
    Where they waiting for the first november?
    Am I too suspicious?

  12. copydude says:

    Thanks for the link to Guzzanti’s blog.

    Even using Google translate, it’s hard to follow. Mostly because it’s a complex web of intrigue. And as Simona writes, now the cat is out of the bag, everyone is either retracting what was reported, calling everyone else a liar or denying that they’d ever met or spoken.

    Some good recent
    English background here on Scaramella’s role in defaming Prodi and a good run down from the IHT on his infamous career to date.

    However, it’s undeniable that Scaramella has links to both MI6 and the CIA and to the exiles Gordievsky (MI6) and Litvinenko – both friends of Berezovsky. Would they – plus MI6 – have been employed to help Tony Blair’s friend, Berlusconi, smear his opponent?

    Now Guzzanti is certainly having his work cut out trying to appear clean.

  13. pentole.coperchi says:

    Well…. if thos are good recent. Which are the bad?

  14. copydude says:

    Simona,

    Very good digest of the Italian story so far.

    Whom shall we believe?

    Well, we know that Gordievsky is MI6 and disinfo central.

    His role so far has been to further the propaganda story and ‘protect the exiles’. So, like Goldfarb, he rather says what you would expect him to say.

    Limarev? Has changed his story so many times it isn’t true.

    Scaramella? Obviously been lying all his life.

    Litvinenko? Obviously would say anything for money.

    Oh my goodness, that’s a big question!

  15. pentole.coperchi says:

    Completely agree. Big mess.
    I have just asked to Senator Guzzanti to add an english transation of his articles.
    I hope he will provide….
    Thanks for your attention so far.

  16. jforrik says:

    OT, but related.

    Here’s a question I’ve been asking myself: If they made this into a movie, which theory would they portray? Answer – the biggest conspiracy: assasination. And who would star in it? Answer: why Johnny Depp, of course!

    No, really!!

    Here is the news realease:

    Johnny Depp’s production company, Infinitum Nihil, will develop a film based on an as-yet-unwritten book about the poisoning death of former KGB agent Alexander Litvinenko.

    The movie will be an adaptation of the novel “Sasha’s Story: The Life and Death of a Russian Spy,” which is scheduled to come out later this year, Variety reports.

    Shortly before his mysterious death last year, Litvenenko claimed that Russian president Vladimir Putin’s government was behind his poisoning — a claim that the Kremlin has categorically denied.

    Sources say Depp followed the incident closely and is interested in playing the former spy.

    Depp’s next film, “Pirates of the Caribbean: At Worlds End,” is slated for release on May 25.

  17. pentole.coperchi says:

    A new link: Limarev’s blog (if you do not already know of it)
    http://limarev. spaces. live. com

    About his interviews, in Italy, he is asseting to variuos people completely different things.

    I know you all are smart people so maybe will find interesting notices on his recent “blog” that I have not found.

    Many thank’s. Simona

  18. copydude says:

    I wrote up this new input today as a digest on my blog – mostly so I’d set down my own understanding and have everything, links’n'all, in one place. Many thanks to Simona for input.

    But it is complex, so Strataspherians, please bear with me and feel free to comment on the story and offer corrections. I’d like to clear this up in my own mind.

    Reading it through, it now raises a few more questions about the whole Litvinenko business. (As if there aren’t enough already.)

    Remember that Sasha was very suspicious of Scaramella’s visit? Quotes: ‘He didn’t want to eat, he didn’t want to stay with me any longer than necessary, he could have sent the information by e-mail?’

    What was the real purpose of Mario’s visit then?

    It is Gordievsky who reassures Litvinenko that Scaramella was a mere ‘soap bubble’. But the more we discover about Scaramella, the more dangerous he appears. Certainly no mere soap bubble could have conned the UN, NATO and the European Union. And out of several million.

    At one early point, (can’t find the link right now) Sasha decides that Putin sent Scaramella. Who was Scaramella working for? The ex-CIA links are as wobbly as everything on Mario’s CV. It is also quite possible to see Scaramella’s false promises to Guzzanti as ‘entrapment’.

    Curiouser and curiouser.

    By the way, Simona, your link had spaces in it and faults to another Limarev.

    The correct link is:

    http://limarev.spaces.live.com

  19. Ermit says:

    Hi, Simona,

    Thanks for your brilliant summary. I never knew Talik was still in prison now. Reuters said Talik refused commentary on the phone. Could you elabotate?

    The real purpose of Mr Scaramella’s vist was attending an IMO annual session in London. Why not to use the London visit to discuss the Limarev’s memorandum with Mz Litvinenko? Mr Scaramella ate in a Pizza Burger before meeting Mr Litvinenko. It is the police data. Certainly, as an expert in the Mitrochin Commission Prof. Scaramella knew not only CIA agents but also spoke several times even with Kolmogorov, a deputy chief of the FSB in the KGB Headqurters in Moscow. That is what Mr Litvinenko said in hospital.