Apr 17 2007
“Ismail’s Ax”?
We may have to go back to the question of religious motivations with the killer at VA Tech. Thanks to commentors here and other bloggers it seems there is a connection to Ismail and the descendants of the Arabs versus Isaac and the descendants of Judaism. Here is something I found of interest:
The narrative of Abraham, Father Abraham as he is often called, has long been recognized by religion teachers as an entry into the study of three religions of the book, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.
Because of Abraham’s exulted place, part of his story is a good starting point for teaching about other world religions. And because his story is currently attracting the attention of diverse religious and peace groups, it is a story that can better help us understand friends of many faiths. His story is especially poignant as we also look at artistic interpretation that can help us see how readers of the sacred story can interpret it differently. His story has also attracted the attention of modern politicians, writers and peace groups who find in Abraham a common father to people of three faiths.
…
A careful reading of this passage reveals some wonderful and subtle differences from the account in Genesis 22. They are differences that make a difference for the reader trying to understand how people of different religions see the world. Especially interesting is the obvious compliance by the son in the Koran: “So when they had both Submitted their wills (to God).†This is something we only guess at reading the Bible. In addition, the age of the son is more precise in the Koran and the detail about the son face down on the altar may remove only slightly the sense of the terror. The real difference is in the footnote. The son in this Moslem story is Ishmael. In the Bible the son is Isaac.
This from note 4101 in The Holy Koran may help us understand: The Jewish tradition, in order to glorify the younger branch of the family, descended from Isaac, ancestor of the Jews, as against the elder branch, descended from Ismail [Koran spelling], ancestor of the Arabs, refers this sacrifice to Isaac. Now Isaac was born when Abraham was 100 years old while Ismail was born to Abraham when Abraham was 86 years old. Ismail was therefore 14 years older than Isaac. During his first 14 years Ismail was the only son of Abraham; at no time was Isaac the only son of Abraham. Yet, in speaking of the sacrifice, the Old Testament says (Gen. 22:2) ‘And He said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering…’
We know how fanatics can twist things around, so does “Ismails Ax” refer to the older son of Abraham taking up his father’s ax against the non-believers? Or is it a sign of taking on the evil Jews?
While this gross crime of a father slaughtering his own son is mentioned in the Bible, it is not supported by the Quran. These teachings of the traditional Muslim scholars are only a reflection of the outside corruption and Jewish influence on the early Muslim scholars. Jewish influence could not affect the word of God in the Quran but found its way into the Hadith books that were written 250+ years after the death of the prophet. The prophet was not around to defend all the false teachings in them.
Is it coincidence that “Ismails Ax” killed a well known holocaust survivor? Who knows, just running down links based on what “Islmails Ax” could mean. Much more here on the mention of Ismael in the Koran.
Update: For those like me who need a lesson on Ishmael and the Arabs and Koran here is some more background. Final note: I have no idea what the saying means or was intended to mean, I am just looking at possible meanings. It seems likely they guy was simply unstable – we don’t know which means we can and should explore alternatives until we do know.
I would not try to connect this to Islam other than to point out something described in literature. AJ, I believe going along that line of thinking and even insuating that this could have even a hint of islamic terrorism (aside from maybe the killer himself wanting to use a figure from that cultural history just to cause people to go down that road and possibly be even more afraid or make his deed somehow ‘larger’ in their minds) is totally off the wall. There is absolutely nothing to suggest this kid had ever even seen the inside of a mosque in his life. In fact, I don’t think I have even heard of a Korean muslim. Most of the Koreans around here are pretty conservative christians.
The kid grew up right there in Virginia. For all practical purposes he was just as American as any other kid that goes to elementary, middle, and high school here in the US.
Oh, and of course Ishmael is going to be mentioned in the Koran … Ishmael and Jacob are the sons of Abraham. Depending on who you talk to and what you believe, one son’s tribe because the Jews and the other son became the Muslims. But I don’t think it is in the context of religion in this case so much as it is in the context of a deed done by that figure in cultural history.
Oops, ment Isaac, not Jacob
Let me put it another way … if I wanted to scare the bejezuz out of people, I would yell “Aloha Snackbar!” as I was shooting people. Wouldn’t mean I was a muslim or comitting any act of organized terror, just that I was trying to maximize the effect on people.
CP,
I have no information about what it means and if he was Muslim. But he grew up on progressive NoVa so his comments about women did not come from here, but could have come from a religious connections. And we have an expanding Muslim population here so he easily could have come in contact with the idealogy.
Aj:
That is a literary device. And Cho was an English major. I think you are jumping the gun here.
It is just possible that the guy was your typical garden variety homicidal maniac. I knew a young man who killed himself by plunging a butcher knife in his own heart. He was no more Muslim than I am, but he was delusional and in the last days of his life he was saying some really crazy things. They made sense to him however, and when his mother found him dead in the shower they made an awful kind of sense to her too.
“That is a literary device. And Cho was an English major. I think you are jumping the gun here.”
I agree 100%
I am not making any claims – just passing on information. I am fully leaning towards the lone nutjob right now – but that phrase is important it seems and worth exploring.
He could just as easily have used a “Sodom and Gomorrah” angle. Would that have made him righteous?
He was a “foreign” kid that moved to Centerville, VA He was probably never accepted by the kids there when he was in school. I would be willing to bet he didn’t have many friends growing up and probably not to many other Korean families around at that time either. If his family was like Korean families around here, they didn’t waste a lot of money on fancy duds or toys and they probably pushed him hard to get good grades. In other words, he probably saw other kids having a lot of fun but chances are he spent his spare time working at the family business and he wasn’t a part of the other kids’ fun.
I would guess that he was a very jealous and angry young man without many friends who probably had very few friends since moving to this country.
Ismail ibn Jafar = Thought by Shi’ite Muslims to have been the rightful Imam of Islam and it is him who they follow.
AX: I am having trouble with that. Could it be a mathematics term? Or a poetic term?
It refers to a book by Cooper, I think it is the Prairie in which the character Ismail has an axe. This axe can be used as a weapon or it can be used to create, to build. That is the conflict in the device. It has been awhile since my college Lit classes, but I think that is right.
The first words in Moby Dick were “Call me Ishmael” weren’t they? This names goes back to the old testament and Abraham. But the truth is that name used to be more common than it is now. I had an ancestor back in the early 19th century with that name and another named Elizah. In many examples of classic literature from that period these names are used. It does not have to be religious at all.
There are lots of references to it. Here is another:
Be interesting to know if he called his girlfriend “Sunshine”.
You all know, I’m a supporter of the SJS analysis, and definitely anti-Jihadi (unlike the “PC” MSM); but I think the “Muslim” angle in this story, is on very thin ice at this time; and we may never know what went thru his twisted mine, in the end, to maybe give the slaughter more “oomph”; so, this is from a poster over at Capt Quarter’s, and it seems to make the most sense to me right now:
Ismail Ax” ?
Ismail….a literary term
Moby-Dick is an 1851 novel by Herman Melville
The first line of Chapter One (“Call me Ishmael.”) is one of the most famous in American literature.
…the narrator, Ishmael, who introduces himself with the famous line “Call me Ishmael”.
Moby-Dick is a highly symbolic work…themes include racism, hierarchical relationships, and politics.
The name has come to symbolize orphans, exiles, and social outcasts-in the opening paragraph of Moby-Dick,
Ishmael tells the reader that he has turned to the sea out of a feeling of alienation from human society.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moby-Dick
Ax …a electronic gaming term
…Nintendo Game…two different versions…AX for the arcade…GX for the Gamecube
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-Zero_AX
PC baangs
…South Korea’s gaming addicts
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/2499957.stm
http://news.com.com/South+Korea+leads+the+way/2009-1034_3-5261393.html
Posted by: LTC at April 17, 2007 01:36 PM
Crosspatch; I think you’re onto something too, with the whole “literary angle”/English Major thing, as well!
From a poster over at Capt’s Quarter’s; makes sense to me; the whole Islamic thing just doesn’t ring true here right now, and you all know I’m a believer in SJS:
Ismail Ax” ?
Ismail….a literary term
Moby-Dick is an 1851 novel by Herman Melville
The first line of Chapter One (“Call me Ishmael.”) is one of the most famous in American literature.
…the narrator, Ishmael, who introduces himself with the famous line “Call me Ishmael”.
Moby-Dick is a highly symbolic work…themes include racism, hierarchical relationships, and politics.
The name has come to symbolize orphans, exiles, and social outcasts-in the opening paragraph of Moby-Dick,
Ishmael tells the reader that he has turned to the sea out of a feeling of alienation from human society.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moby-Dick
Ax …a electronic gaming term
…Nintendo Game…two different versions…AX for the arcade…GX for the Gamecube
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-Zero_AX
PC baangs
…South Korea’s gaming addicts
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/2499957.stm
http://news.com.com/South+Korea+leads+the+way/2009-1034_3-5261393.html
Posted by: LTC at April 17, 2007 01:36 PM
Could it have been this this shooter was into the sci-fi series about Ax?
Could he have seen himself as a hero who was out of place with his human counterparts? Someone who was torn by his own ideals and those of the ones who were different from him, especially the killing of animals and genocide?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aximili-Esgarrouth-Isthill
I think this is a case where Occam’s Razor applies; when in doubt, go with the simplest explaination!
That said, some interesting things I just researched:
a) Islam is the fastest growing religion in South Korea
b) there is currently NO evidence to show the shooter was a Muslim, or that his family was!
c) the Koreans love to adopt new religions; as someone somewhere above mentioned, Christian Korean’s are some o f the most dedicated; and when they do something, they do it 100%; so it’s also no surprise to me, that with the increasing economic ties between Korea and the Middle East, Islam is the fastest growing religion there!
That said, my current thinking means this is all just triva, because even though I was one of the first two people on this board to bring up the possible SJS/Jihadi angle, I don’t hink there’s much to it…..yet!
I can confirm one other thing: I’m in a business where I interact with scores of Asians on a daily and weekly basis. Hundreds of them, in this country, especially from China and Korea, adopt an English sounding First Name, to fit in better, and to make it easier for people to call them by something, without embarrasing themselves!
Okay, roundup: R05, Terrye, and Crosspatch, plus the poster from CG’s, I think, all have good points!
First, we’re probably all stupid, for trying to make sense of this obvious nutbag!
Right now, I think the sexual abuse angle, has much more promise than the Islamic angle.
That said, as all have pointed out, he was an English/Literary Major, and I think the allusions to:
James Fennimore Cooper
Moby Dick
Ismail’s Ax (Koranic)
and even the video game angle’s pointed out by the poster from CQ and R05, ALL have merit!
This was a smart, but crazy guy; no one should fall so in love with their own pet theory, to discount the possibility that he noticed that “Ismail Ax”, tied nicely into ALL those things!
I see this all the time, in the Historian, Archaeologist, Paleontology, Anthropology, Geology and even INTEL ranks: Author “A” comes up with their pet theory, and fall in love with it, and champion it to the EXCLUSION of all other theories/evidence!
In fact, Life is never that simple, nor easy! People rarely have ONE single motivation for something; usually it’s a fusion of Many things!
Just look at the competing theories as to why Dinosaurs went extinct: Asteroids, Global Warming, Volcanic Eruptions, Atmospheric Oxygen changing levels, heck even Dinosaur Flatulence has been propsed!
The proponents of all these different theories, trumpet them to the exclusion of ALL the others!
I’ve never heard anyone say, that in fact, it could be a combination of ALL those things! And that is probably closer to the “truth”!
So, in otherwords, with a twistedly wicked sharp mind like the shooter, he could have been, if not probably was, aware of most of these things that have been discussed in this thread, and thus in fact, there cannot ever be one, single, simple explaination for it!