Jun 02 2007
More Far Right Insults
Charles Krautheimer has joined the Immigration Hypochondriacs in insulting those conservatives who want more than just border secrurity:
U.S. Immigration Bill Is Served Up With A Large Side Of Stupidity And Farce
Ahh – the eloquance and maturity from the far right! LOL! Of course this death spiral on the right is all predicated on their warped logic on some simple poll numbers:
A Rasmussen poll had shown that 72 percent of Americans thought border enforcement and reducing illegal immigration to be very important. Only 29 percent thought legalization to be very important.
But 65% in Rassmussen’s poll also support a compromise in the form of a guest worker program. So how is it possible? Simple – we have two camps on the conservative side. One camp supports borders and a guest worker program. The other opposes any guest worker program. So what is the 72% who support borders? Clearly it is both camps who agree on this and this alone. But those willing to accept a guest worker program in order to get a bill passed is 65%. That means less than 10% are so hard over they would tank the entire Bill over the guest worker provisions.
This is all inside Rasmussen’s own numbers. It mirrors the polls going back years showing support for the guest worker program (which cannot hope to work with out border enhancements – and vise versa). So while Krautheimer throws insults I can still do basic math. And the immigration hypochondriacs, while vocal and having some of the best media megaphones, do not have the numbers to pull off their little temper tantrums. And they are burning their bridges fast. When the polls come out next week and the margins have not changed, then what will be the next threat from the right? They will stop talking?? One could hope they could just stop being so damn nasty.
While everybody is arguing the pros and cons of whether this bill should or should not be passed, shouldn’t someone ask if we can really afford all these new ” legalized” citizens ? While everyone thinks the US is the richest country in the world, we have been living on credit for the past 50 plus years. The “surpluses” during the 90’s were a smoke and mirror bookkeeping con which showed the books were balanced while the national debt increased from $3 billion to $6 billion. Bill Clinton added more to the national debt that Reagan and Bush 1 combined, yet he and his fellow con artists are given credit for pulling off the miracle of running a surplus. Before everyone jumps on the bandwagon to legalize more people so they can attach themselves to the public tit, we need to look at just how much it is going to cost us in the long run. Since we live in a bankrupct country which is living on credit, it’s time we tightened the belt and cut off aid and assistance to any and all persons and entitites who not legal citizens who are entitled to them. I challenge anyone to show me where the Constitution guarantees that people in this country illegally are entitled to any government funded benefits, whether they be jobs, health care, food assistance, housing, education, bilingual ballots, or whatever. Prosecute, fine and jail employers who hire illegal workers and cut off the assistance benefits and they will go home. We dont’ need any more new laws. We have enough laws on the books already. We just need to enforce the laws we already have. Passing laws that are not going to be inforced is a sign that we have already reached third world status where there are different rules for enforcing the law for them and us.
AJ – I have read your blog for sometime now and for the most part, particularly on our war with Radical Islam, your blog is one of the very best. I could not disagree with you more, however, with your support for this monstrous, loophole filled, illegal immigration bill that fails to secure the border first while every illegal immigrant in this country will become legal the minute the bill is signed into law.
Others have done an excellent job in highlighting the bills weaknesses and the disasters that will surely follow so my comment to you will deal with just who is it that’s forcing this issue and why are they doing it at this most critical time in our country’s history.
First, it is President Bush, Senators McCain, Kyle, Martinez, our RINO’s for the most part and the vast majority of Democrats. It is not the conservative base of the Republican Party forcing this issue at this critical time.
Second, the President and the Republican supporters of this bill know full well the furor this issue caused last year and they, without a doubt, see the utter destruction they are bringing to our party this year. RNC contributions are down 40% since this issue came to light yet they are blind to this reality.
About the only people that continue to support our President in our War with Radical Islam is the conservative base of the party which, for the most part, only insists that the 800 mile fence approved by congress last year be finished, FIRST. Only about 2 miles of that fence has been completed. It is we who are working in this country’s best interest. We simply have no confidence in more long-term government promises.
If this bill becomes law the Democrats will be the majority party for decades to come. If it is defeated, the Republican Party has an excellent opportunity to win not only the
Presidency but both houses of congress as well, in the 2008 elections. Can you not visualize Fred Thompson and the other Republicans demanding secure borders first while Hillary and the Democrats are running for amnesty now and just more promises for a secure border sometime later. Rasmussen says this is the position of the vast majority of voters. I firmly believe him.
Thanks for opening your blog to new registration.
AJ & Terrye: You guys are sounding like Rodney King “Can’t we all get along” and maybe the immigrants including the illegals,who will become legal if this bill passes,will vote Republican. Can I sell you some blibbets? You can’t see Teddy the swimmer, McCain, and Graham laughing their a—-s off knowing if the bill passes or not the Dems will win the mexican vote. Senators. McConnell and Kyl were duped by the swimmer and “f–k you” McCain and then sucked in Pres. Bush who believes in his heart we need a bill on a promise he made many, many years ago to the mexican people. Dealing with the swimmer in the educational program did not teach Bush a damn thing. Look for independent candidates running this year from the Republican side. Reading the bloggers’ comments is a learning experience with knowledge, experience and common sense. Hey -bigLSUsports fan – I do not believe many of the politicians because they tend to play the game of politics in an unscrupulous way in order to be elected. AJ – great blog – keep the comments coming.
BigLSU, you bring up some interesting points. Let me tell you this about my Rep. – Republican Spencer Bachus. His office would not discuss immigration with me, beyond a paragraph or so of boilerplate drivel. I got absolutely nowhere.
Spencer Bachus was a member of Tancredo’s CIRC – Cong. Imm Reform Caucus, which mysteriously disbanded months ago and supposedly reorganized under the direction of Tom Bilbray (R-CA). But go look at Bilbray’s site… there’s one page with a few paragraphs about CIRC… but there is NO MEMBERSHIP LIST! Why? Last Feb. when I tried to learn the names, I ran into a brick wall.
Anyway, a few months ago I get an email from Rep. Bachus announcing that he’s become John McCain’s Southeast Chairman. Huh? A member of the Tancredo/Bilbray Club now endorsing the “Father of all Mayhem” who authored last year’s eeeeevil Senate Bill on immigration? What is up with that?
Here is what I think.
* Bachus and hopefully a whole lot of other former CIRC members want to slink away from their past association with immigration hysterics. But they can’t exactly say that without a painful and potentially damaging mea culpa.
* There probably is no functional CIRC at this time (another good sign)
This could good news — perhaps an indication that some Reps are beginning to see what they have wrought. It appears few now want to associate with Tancredo/CIRC.
But the bad news is, all of this points to quite a bit of irresponsibility and denial from the worst “conservative” offenders. Ditto that for 99% of the Talk Radio Crowd, and the malevolent bobble heads like Malkin who’ve practically built careers around immigrant bashing. FoxNews is in up to its neck, and of course the abominable Lou Dobbs on CNN. I just don’t see these people and orgs restraining themselves or in any way tempering their comments. They can’t admit the mess they’ve made, and now they want to walk away from the pile and pretend it doesn’t exist.
dale, enforcement, retire et al’s , you are sooo wasting your time with these folks. they ended up supporting a bill they had not read, written by politicians who have never enforced the laws they had previously written, only to find out in a brief reading that they had been had. now they have scramble to find twisted poll numbers to support their case while claiming at the same time they “always” supported enforcing the border–all of 300 miles not 2000.
you are wasting your time.
AJ
It’s pointless to try to reason with these guys. There is zero logic and thought in their position.
I am a “security first” guy and I am spitting mad they are trying to hiijack my position.
Retire05- Terrye hasn’t equated you to Nazis. I did that.
Dubious,
You did not read far enough. The number is there.
AJ,
Read far enough where? I read your post. You never mention the numbers I cite.
Also please answer the point I made on Krauthammer.
Anti-herman, don’t be mislead by my moniker. I have not yet reached the point of senility where I can’t remember who said what. And I have neither the time or desire to backtrack through hundreds of posts to find who said what and when.
You are right. AJ is wasting his time trying to convince those of us who understand that a bill, written as it goes along, and negotiated in the back rooms of the Senate without the normal hearings, is a good thing.
Perhaps you should read the posts and see the questions us “enforcement first” guys have posed. They are rational, logical and to the point. Yet no one on the Kumbaya side have tried to answer them.
There really is only one question: do illegals have the right to be here? And if the answer to that is “no”, then why in the name of God should we cater to them and their native nations?
RETIRE05
I am an “enforcement first” dude, and your belief that your “opinions” are “rational” just proves my point. An arguement that consists of “It’s amnesty” and “Enforce the law” makes the KOS crowd envious. It’s mindless. However, if you care to find out where you are “off the rocker”, please post your question. I’ll explain whu I find your hysteria ans xenophobia so offensive.
It has been 3 or 4 days since I offered to compromise on this bill. Still no takers.
I’ll start anyway. I propose Section 1(A) be amended to read like this –
(a)The provisions of Subtitle C of Title IV, and the
admission of aliens under Section 101(a)(15)(H)(ii) of the Immigration
and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1101(a)(15)(H)(ii)), as amended by Title
IV,
(i) the programs established by Title IV of this Act; and
(ii) the programs established by Title VI of this Act that grant
legal status to any individual or adjust the current status of any
individual who is unlawfully present in the United States to that
of an alien lawfully admitted for provisional residence,
shall become effective on the date that the Secretary submits a written
certification to the President and the Congress that the following
border security and other measures are funded, in place, and in
operation:
Would anyone object to such a change?
ant-herman, exactly what is it about the questions I have posed regarding this bill are hysterical or xenophobic? Because I want to know how they are going to enforce this bill when there is no desire to enforce current laws? Or how a wage earner on the bottom rung is going to ever pay $5,000. in fines? Or how the Senate and Congress can guarantee that the provisions for enforcement will ever be implimented? Is it hysterical or xenophobic to question what the punishment will be for the foreign criminal that stole my Social Security number and is using it all over the nation? Or perhaps you object to the fact that I think it is xenophobic to expect American citizens to pay their taxes every year with the threat of stiff fines and/or imprisonment if they don’t but to give a free pass to those who are here illegally? Or maybe you don’t like the rationale that it is nearly impossible to do a background check on an American citizen within 24 hours, much less a foreign national?
Oh, and one other thing; you forgot to call me a racist. Because that is always the trump card for those of your ilk, isn’t it?
I also couldn’t help but notice that no one refuted my argument that this bill, as is, is bad for National security.
R05: I told you guys upfront, days ago, you might as well just admit that you are a racist, that’s what AJ is hinting around about in all his posts; Terrye has already basically said it, Anti-Herman, has basically just said it, and all because we want some basic things:
a) ANSWERS
b) some changes to the bill to ENSURE our borders
c) a REAL guest worker program, that WORKS, not one that’s just a farce!
I expect to be called a “racist”, by the liberal nutbags, who want to flood the country with ILLEGALS, because they hate America and they want to see it destroyed; they also know that ILLEGALS vote 90% Democrat, and they’re guilty because they’re either rich or white or both!
I NEVER expected for it to be insinuated by people who are supposedly on our own side, just because we want the stupid bill to be REAL, and NOT a FARCE!
That’s what we’re talking about here, really!
As written, as is, the bill is a Kennedyesque FARCE, and because we question that, we get called the “racists”!
It’s just amazing to me..
Dale, this bill is NOT about immigration. This bill is about “brown” people. It is also about moving farther and farther to the left. It Canada’s economy was corrupt and in the tank and Mexico’s economy was sound and properous, we would not be even considering this bill.
So let’s assume this bill is passed. Eight years down the road there are another 10 million illegals who have basically come across the southern border. By then the Republican party is reduced to no more than a memory and a few isolated elected officials who refuse to go down into the night. There is NOTHING to say that those who feel their lofty position deems them more intelligent that the people who elected them will not just say “no more borders. They don’t work” and we will slide into anarchy.
Does anyone think that Hillary and the Drowner are not closet socialists? Really. Just look at Hillary’s latest “robber baron” speech.
Any questions?
I wonder if Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton realize they are about to be replace with the “new” civil rights movement called LaRaza?
DALEINATLANTA
I do not believe we are on the same side. That’s a basic point.
RETIRE05
“How is a bottom rung wage earner going to pay a $5,000 fine?” A good question and one I asked myself. Let’s go through:
First, you claim to have read the bill. You might want to study a little closer. It’s actually $5,000 and appliciable fees. By my estimate that’s around $9000 .
If minimum wage is $5.75, that means someone working 2,000 per week makes $11,500 pretax. That means they after tax takehome is around $9500. So how does a wetback pay?
Simple- THEY CAN”T
Based on the bill, failure to pay these fines and fees means they are not eligable for a Z visa and gots to go back to Mexico. Perhaps they could apply for the “guest worker” section (2 here, 1 gone, 2 here and no more).
Last year I read an article about an Irishman, college graduate, who over stayed his visa (that makes him illegal). He had started and owned a $15 million construction business and employed 20 people. After listening to the high priests of the moonbat right, he said “screw it”. He shut down his company, fired this employees and went to Ireland. He could probably afford the $5000.
Glad someone like that leaves?
I would recommend going to “biglizards.net” for technical info on tamper proof cards and a national backround check system. It’s not my area of expertise, but he has excellent articles on this matter.
Check out the post he has laughing at the stupidity of Hugh Hewitt and Mark Steyn trying to moonbat their was through dissmissing a tamper proof ID card. It’s classic.
Next question!!!!!
RETIRE05
Something to ponder.
Let’s say the gov’t made you pay a full years take home salary to settle a legal issue.
Would that feel like “amnesty”?
Anti-Herman said –
Next question!!!!!
Okay, I have a question.
According to Section 601(e)(6)(A)(i), page 265 of the proposed draft, it says –
–begin quote–
(6) Fees and Penalties-
(A) Processing Fees.—
(i) An alien making an initial application for Z
nonimmigrant status shall be required to pay a
processing fee in an amount sufficient to recover the
full cost of adjudicating the application, but no more
than $1,500 for a single Z nonimmigrant.
–end quote–
With respect to “Z nonimmigrant” visas, and only “Z nonimmigrant” visas, how much to the pay in fines?
Please quote page and paragraph.
I ask this question because I can’t see how you turn $1,500 into $9,000. I look forward to you explaining this and quoting the draft bill as your reference.
Many thanks.
Typo. Sorry. My question should read –
With respect to “Z nonimmigrant†visas, and only “Z nonimmigrant†visas, how much do they pay in fines? Please quote page and paragraph.