Jun 15 2007
GOP Destroyed Either Way? Why Not Just Win Then?
I had pointed out that the amnesty-hypochondriacs (they swear they are not immigration hypochondriacs – fair enough) were destroying the GOP by claiming all common ground with Bush (one of the best conservative Presidents we have had in this country) and other conservatives (Kyl, Graham, Martinez, etc) is now gone. I said that their scortched GOP policy would make alliances with these people impossible in the future. Despite their diversionary excuses, what gauls them is the fact the bill is not harsh enough on the illegal immigrants who have been here for years and years. If that piece was out of the bill they would pass any piece of garbage through and declare victory.
Now, with news that the bill is coming back and should be passed, they have ratcheted up their poisonous talk against fellow conservatives (Bush especially) and are saying if the bill passes it is the end of the GOP! Take Michelle Malkin as an example:
Trent Lott and his ilk are on a suicide mission. Will they bring the GOP–and the country–down without a fight?
The cries of ‘wolf’ from the amnesty hypochondriacs is turning on deaf ears. People are getting fatigued by their endless panic and lashing out. As I said before, the bill passed in the 1980’s was screwed up, but did not end the United State of America. We have been a shining city on the hill since the 1980’s with a strong economy, strong defense, and what was a trend towards conservative values. Until the far right went too far. The cries of ‘wolf’ are not ratcheting up energy – they are creating a backlash and cries of ‘chill out’! Check out this piece by another moderate (i.e, calm and rationale) conservative:
There’s another factor that makes much of talk radio feel like an echo chamber, or the “amen corner,†with the same impassioned arguments deployed again and again and again (“What is it about illegal that you don’t understand?,†“If you reward people for breaking the law, you’ll only get more law-breaking,†“It’s unfair to all the patient legal immigrants to let the illegals cut to the front of the line,†“why don’t they just enforce the laws we have, before we make new laws†etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.) Each of the arguments against the bill can be answered, patiently and substantively, but it’s wearying to go through the same points repeatedly when people on all sides of the argument seem so unwilling to listen.
After several weeks of near hysteria, I believe that most Americans have begun to suffer (appropriately) from “immigration fatigue†– or even “immigration exhaustion.†Angry people let off steam by expressing their righteous wrath repeatedly. The rest of us begin to feel fatigued by all the indignation and apocalyptic talk.
The hyperventilating is getting old. The same old questions asked, answered and answers ignored demonstrates the futility of trying to reason with the unreasonable. But here is the kicker. If the GOP is doomed whether the bill passes or not, then why not pass it? I am not appeasing to the far right, I am simply pointing out if it is their way or the highway, then the highway it is. Either way the GOP is screwed we might as well get what we came for. If the far right is unwilling to bend, then there is no reason to bend anymore and just do the right thing. The amnesty hypochondriacs have played this badly despite pleas not to do so. But if they want a test then a test they shall have. When the bill passes and the world does not end and America is still the shining city on the hill we will know. We will know America is much stronger than many on the right give her credit for. And we will know why those who attack their allies fail in the long run.
Here’s a real clever comment by a poster named Bill Faith over at CQ:
Short answer to why the Republican Party’s future looks grim: Alienation
Couldn’t agree more.
I have to say that, unfortunately, it is always the radicals on either side of the polar, political spectrum that leads to mischaracterization of the the respective parties as a whole. And the MSM, blogosphere, talk radio and other media outlets provides radicals with the means of spewing their tantrums. Face it, moderates likely don’t spend their time commenting on blogs as much since they view issues as a package and not as the single most important issue that will make or break a party (at least this is what I believe).
For the Dems, it is the radical liberal hissyfitters and, for the Reps, its the radical conservative hissyfitters. It always seems that each party is going to be governed by one issue, whichever that flavor of the congressional session may be (abortion, Iraq, immigration, taxation, health care, etc.).
I know as a member of the center right, I am fatigued the friends on the far right. But that doesn’t mean that I will fold up and let the temper tantrums have the predominant voice in how the country is run.
Just a thought.
I couldn’t agree more. Time to call the bluff. We could even argue that it’s more urgent to pass imm reform now, on the assumption that that the “GOP is destroyed either way.” If we abandon the task now, ostensibly leaving it for Hillary & a Dem congress, we will surely guarantee a terrible piece of legislation in a couple short years.
A.J. – I sent your commentary to Michael Medved and received this response which he asked me to post:
Brilliant point, AJ, brilliantly argued. Honored to find myself quoted in this cause. The only cure, ultimately, to IDS (Immigration Derangement Syndrome) is to pass comprehensive reform and then watch the fever subside. What are they going to do, start agitating for repeal the day after it passes? If, however, we stall and do nothing, then the disease will continue to ravage the minds of otherwise sane people and the GOP will suffer even more dire damage. The calculus is clear…..
Michael Medved
The GOP will not be destoyed at all if this bill passes. However if this issue goes on too much longer I am not sure.
The horrible comments that exists on COnservative sites and blogs exist. There is no sense in pretending that they don’t. That stuff gets picked up and before long we will be known as a anti hispanic party
One other thing. Trent Lott, Kyl, and Graham are no liberals. They are also pretty smart politicians. They also have have tons of aces to internal polls the RNC runs. They know what is right in the long run
ALso for those that want to abandon BUsh. Sen Sessions of Alabama is giving Bush fits on this bill. Desppite that Bush will be showing up at a major Fundraiserefor him in the coming weeks. That should show how we should all act
One other thing. Trent Lott, Kyl, and Graham are no liberals. They are also pretty smart politicians. They also have have tons of aces to internal polls the RNC runs. They know what is right in the long run
ALso for those that want to abandon BUsh. Sen Sessions of Alabama is giving Bush fits on this bill. Desppite that Bush will be showing up at a major Fundraiserefor him in the coming weeks. That should show how we should all act
AJ says that the GOP is being destroyed by the split in the party [wishful thinking on AJ’s part?].
Let me explain it this way:
bloggers have a tip jar. AJ’s tip jar is at the upper right had corner of his site. People who support AJ and like what he writes want to help him keep the site functioning by dumping a few coins in his tip jar. Other bloggers strive for the same, hoping readers will dump a few coins in their tip jars.
The GOP is no different. The difference now is that instead of dumping coins into a tip jar that benefits ALL bloggers, people are now putting their coins into an individual tip jar, i.e. local and state GOP funds. The head of the Texas GOP announced earlier this week that the donations are coming in in record amounts. Why? Because of the TxGOP’s stand on IL-legal immigration. GOP members are saying “I don’t like the blogger Chuck Hagel, John McCain [who is now having a financial crisis] or Lindsey Graham, so I will give to the person that expresses MY views”. They are putting their coins into the tip jars of those who express their opinions and so national support is down.
Sorry AJ, the GOP is here to stay. But at least we are not afraid to go against those who would act as our handlers. We prove, once again, we are not sheeple to be lead by the ring in our nose. That, AJ, is the strength of the GOP.
Another opinion from the far-rightwing “immigration hypochondiacs”:
http://www.captainsquartersblogspot.com/mt/archives/010249.php#comments
If you can’t link it, just go to Captain’s Quarters and read his last entry on immigration.
Thanks SallyVee – and thanks Michael Medved. Truly ,we can put and end to this by just passng it, and move on to other matters.
If any of you think that just forcing this abortion on the American public is going to shut everyone up, you are as wrong as a football bat! First of all, what kind of person tells the large majority of people, we don’t care what you think, we’re going to do what we want and to hell with you! This is a democratic republic, your extreme arrogance doesn’t entitle you to tell everyone to pack sand! It is more than clear that the vast majority of people in this country are dead set against this steaming pile of legislation even those of you in the Rectal Ostrich Nation refuse to admit it. If it gets passed by a few crooked politicians in George Soros pocket, there will be a backlash, it will be challenged in court because the senate is not legally permitted to create any law that affects taxes. Which is why I still don’t believe it will get through the house. There will be numerous state and local laws proposed to stop the invasion of our country that the fed will have nothing to do about. And about the next election, there is already a move afoot to defeat every republican incumbent who supported this bill with a anti-illegal immigration replacement. If you don’t think that is going to be a strong movement, you’re dreaming.
I have listened to Medved on this issue, as a matter of fact, I’m listening to him right now. He is an idiotic mouthpiece for the bill. He has one person after another call him up and challenge him, I have heard almost nobody call him up and support it, and he gets creamed by logic every time. He does the same thing AJ does, he says, I’m not going to explain all of how I think this bill is good form America again, I already have. And he never has. Medved really believes that day workers are going to pay $5000 fines, he really believes that they will do everything like it says in the bill. Even after talking to illegals on his show who tell him outright, they are never going back to mexico for a ‘touchback’ and they will not participate in the guest worker program. Now he is talking about McCain being in trouble if the bill DOESN’T pass. What an idiot! McCain is tanking because of his roll in trying to pass it! Medved is just not seeing a clear picture on this issue.
I wonder what the hell you bill supporters are thinking, what do you think this country is going to look like twenty years from now if we bring in another 40-50 million unskilled socialists? What do you expect to happen? You think they are all going to get education and go to trade schools and become prosperous english speaking American citizens? Some will, a hell of a lot won’t. They will push for more socialist programs and the middle class will virtually dissappear. Those of you who say it will never happen are already WRONG, because it is happening now. There are several areas of this country that are no longer a shining light on a hill. They are starting to look more like a hobos campfire on a landfill. But since YOU don’t live there, it must not be true. You stick your finger up to the majority of the country and then whine about all of the vitriol coming from the people who are trying to save this country. You weasels make me sick!
Bikerken,
It will not shut EVERYONE up – but passing the bill will mean the rest of us won’t care anymore and will not need to listen.
That’s a great idea AJ, P*ss off most of the country and then turn a deaf ear. That plan always goes well doesn’t it?
By the way, for those of you who think this is just a fight on the right, you should check out the raging left comments on the Daily Kos regarding this bill. Very revealing! Many of them think this will kill the democrats more than the repubs.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/6/14/20659/0284
AJ
If you look at all the polls in total, yes individual portions of the bill have some support, but consistently when asked the support for the overall approach is under 30% if all polls are considered.
The bill has some good points and it has many bad ones.
I won’t say the sky is falling, but I will say I don’t have a lot of confidence that the bill will function as it is being sold to be.
Now as I have said before, if you put people in a semi-legal status and the thing progresses as I and many others believe it will, then you can not unring the bell.
I see issues of chain migration authorized under the bill and the separate guest worker portion and add up the numbers and do not realistically see how that many mostly low skilled workers can be adsorbed into the system.
To date even the proponents of the bill have never addressed that issue as well as others and seem to be just willing to wing it and hope for the best.
Bikerken,
No one is going to listen to the fringe on the left or the right anymore. And it won’t anger anyone who matters.
>
Sounds to me as though you’re as unbending as anyone.
Untitled Document
This bill has several hurdles to overcome. The major hurdle it has to overcome is that people don’t trust our Government to secure our border. And the public’s lack of trust in our Government to do that is justified.
Witness how President Bush reluctantly signed the border enforcement bill passed just prior to the 06 elections. Everyone knew he was only doing in the hope of getting out more votes from the Republican base. No one believed for a nano-second that he actually wanted to sign it.
Look at all of the comments Michael Chertoff has publicly made about securing the border. He has openly said that he has no intention of securing the border until AFTER a comprehensive reform bill is passed.
And if you want to find out what their true motives are, simply go read the “Building a North American Community” report from the Counsel on Foreign Relations.
Once you read that report, everything that they are doing will make perfect sense. It will all become crystal clear. You don’t even need to read the full report if you are short on time or short on patience. Just read the "Introduction". The usual crap at the front takes up 22 pages. If your pdf viewer shows the pdf page number, skip to pdf page 23.
Now it should be obvious what their real agenda is, and it isn’t about securing the United State’s borders.
Ever wonder what kind of flaming loon would propose a "path to citizenship" prior to securing the border? Obviously, such a strategy will create a HUGE run on the border. So, why do that? To quote President Bush, "That doesn’t make any sense."
Well, it does make sense once you realize what their real goal is. It makes perfect sense then.
There is an interesting post about this very subject over at eagleforum.org. It is here – CFR’s Plan to Integrate the U.S., Mexico and Canada
The author does a good job of laying it all out. Once you CFR’s report and Phyllis’s article, it will all make perfect sense. All of the pieces of the puzzle will just fall in place.
>
Sounds to me as though you’re as unbending as anyone.
Smill953,
You mean I am willing to fight for what I think is best? You bet. I am as good as anyone else. And there are millions out there, many conservatives, fighting to get this done. So I use rhetoric from the amnesty hypochondriacs to show why they are so wrong. Welcome to politics.
The last excerpt is from page 6 of the introduction and not page 1. Typo. Sorry.
Read that report and you will see that President Bush and Michael Chertoff are silently following the recommendations in that report.
After you read those recommendations, President Bush’s actions will suddenly make a lot more sense.
More info is also available at http://www.spp.gov
Go check out that U.S. government web site. Read it, and then ask yourself if they have any intention of securing the U.S.’s borders.