Dec 13 2007
Boehner: Immigration Still Killing GOP Efforts For 2008
GOP Minority Leader Boehner has admitted publicly what was clear for months now – the immigration debacle from last spring is killing the GOP fundraising efforts for 2008.
Polls show the public holds congressional Republicans in low esteem. Boehner’s effort to craft a new agenda for Republicans remains under wraps. And in the minority leader’s own words, their fundraising “sucks.â€
“Now the money sucks for two reasons,†Boehner said in a Politico interview. “People are mad at the president; they are mad at the party. And then [there is] this whole immigration fight. People just turned off the spigot.â€
The Amnesty Hypochondriacs (I use this term because the only issue that stopped the bill from passing this spring was the process for dealing with long term illegal aliens in country and free of violent crime) are a small group. Too small to win elections, and apparently too small to fund them as well. In their scorched Earth attack on the rest of the GOP (how can we forget “El Presidente Jorge Bush, the treasonous traitor”) they succeeded in pushing more of the moderate middle to the moderate dems (affectionately derided as RINO and traitors themselves). They were able to repulse so much of the GOP base it cannot hope to take back Congress with the current schism in place.
The fact the GOP is still harboring hope of some measure of come back is because of the disastrous performance of the Dems. But the truth is to get back in the game they need to go back to the immigration bill defeated this spring. The far right can shore up anything they want but they must keep the program for investigating long term illegals to ensure they are free of violent crimes and then have them pay retribution to stay here and live out their lives if they so chose. Because if they cannot make this turn around themselves then no one else is going to pay a dime to a party that harbors the likes of Tancredo. BTW, clear proof Tancredo’s views on immigration are a disaster is the measure of his own fund raising success – he lags behind even the Iraq SurrenderMaster himself, Ron Paul! His anemic support is where the party is heading if voices like his dominate the GOP.
Look at it from our perspective, those not so far right. We are not going pay money so a few obsessed folks on the right can institute a program where Federal agents come storming into our communities, ripping people out of their homes and jobs, splitting up families and replaying the Elian Gonzales episode thousands of times each night for three decade or more (which is what it will take to force the deportation of the 10-20 million long term members of our community – do the math). We are all for getting rid of the violent criminals who have clearly worn out their welcome here as immigrants. Round them up all day long – as the bill last spring would have authorized.
But why would we pay our money to turn America into a police state? Why would we allow Federal agents to surround homes down the street with assault weapons? The Elian Gonzales incident was a travesty. It demonstrated using the power of the government to dictate who gets and does not get freedom. It was a stark reminder of how power can be abused. We will not spend OUR money so pictures like the one below can be repeated in every city, town and hamlet every night.
This is not a negotiation folks, it is a statement of principle. The far right likes to conflate a paperwork misdemeanor with a felony crime. But on the flip side we can see the makings of a police state that uses the power of the federal government to enforce paperwork. If some can confuse maids and nannies with terrirists they have no business getting upset when other folks look at them and see something really bad. Just morph Tancredo’s smiling face onto the picture above and you will see what many of us see. Sorry, someone had to say all this because it had to be said.
It was a few in the far right going way too far most people in this country that caused this, and then being insulting to others when everyone did not follow their views. Until they admit it, and make amends, there will be no ability to compete with the dems in terms of grass roots support. The dems seem to be able to tolerate a lot more intolerance towards others and heavy handedness than conservatives will ever accept. It was why they had lost the ability to govern. But some in the GOP deicded to follow the Carville-Begala path to disaster and put the GOP over the cliff as well. Bad choice.
The far right opened this civil war among conservatives, and they are the ones who must repair the damage. And sweet talking platitudes are not going to make the cut. The dems may be able to fool their base, the GOP should never make the same assumption about the conservative moderates. Want support, start acting like you respect those in the coalition who will work with you on common ground. Just don’t expect us to be robots.
Update: Some think one race in Ohio means the GOP will benefit from bashing immigrants – which is what they do when they try and tar all immigrants with the acts of the criminal few in their huge numbers. It is akin to tarring Americans overall with the acts of Geoffrey Dahlmer. I guess I don’t need to remind people of the drubbing the GOP took in VA on this issue.
AJ, I know you have ample reason to diss the Conservatives about immigration. I am a Conservative, and I live in AZ. I wish that people who disagree with me would stick to the subject and not zero in on bigotry.
We have been lied to since the 1986 amnesty act. They were going to legalize the 3 million illegals in this country and secure our borders. We got the legalization, but somehow the border enforcement dropped off the radar screen. When this new approach started last year, we had had 21 years of unchecked illegal immigration. Liberal judges had granted these illegals all rights of Americans, including free health care, free education, free everything. I don’t know how it is where you live, but going to the emergency room here is not any fun. Having gang members with their gang attitudes being policed by police with drug dogs in the emergency room does not encourage an average LEGAL American to go there.
I don’t know about the rest, I’m sure you can pull up quotes from the extremes, but as a conservative, I don’t want to “deport them all”. I want the United States to enforce it’s laws. I want laws to mean something again. If I did identity theft to the extent that these people do, I would be in jail. Why do legal Americans get punished for doing the same thing that illegal Americans can get away with? If we verified legal status when they are pulled over by the police and when they enter their children in school and when they get a job, self-deportation with take care of a lot of the problem. Quite frankly, here in AZ, just the threat of verifying legality at the work place already is working.
Once we have secured our borders properly, then, yes, we should have a system to deal with those that are here. But granting legal status to lawbreakers sticks in the craw of law-abiding Americans who are down here on the border living what you see on TV.
That is why, until the laws that are already on the books of the United States are enforced, why should we make new laws? It’s kind of like when the Republicans compromise with the Democrats. Have you ever noticed that the Republicans give over something important, and then the Democrats completely ignore what they agreed to do, and we are all supposed to just accept it as business as usual and move on?
This country is not a country of bigots. The overwhelming tidal wave of anti-illegal immigration that you have seen this year is a result of being lied to time and again about “enforcing the borders”. A speech is made, applause, and then nothing is done. Illegals get more and more “rights” and yet the borders aren’t enforced. This country is a magnet because we give them plenty of goodies and let them get away with murder (literally, here in AZ). If we try to prosecute an illegal for MURDER, we have the Mexican Government interfering in our judicial system. We’re tired of it. Either we are a sovereign country or we are not.
I haven’t even brought up the subject of terrorism, which is a large part of the border enforcement complaint.
Cheryl Wilson
Mesa, AZ
Cheryl,
Thanks for the comments. Under the laws on the books overstaying a visa is a misdemeanor offense. That IS the fact today.
And while things may stick in some craws, the logistics of the problem is we need those who are harmless to this country from a terrorist or crime threat to step forward so we can identify and deport the true trouble makers.
Providing incentives (permission to stay) to get people identified and interviewed – along with reasonable punishments for misdemeanor paperwork crimes (paying back taxes) IS the fastest way to secure our borders and ourselves.
Instead of chasing down nannies with our limited resources we chase down those who refuse to come forward and become part of a workable and manageable process.
But all that is gone now because of some folks with stuck craws. That is not an excuse in my mind to leave us exposed to the threat of terrorists and the violence of criminals who could be deported RAPIDLY under the bill Tancredo and his ilk tanked.
I am not going on about bigots – I am talking about crazy fantasies which have no basis in reality. We had our chance for huge leaps forward in security and people lied and said we don’t need it. We can do it under existing laws. And then they claim months later we need radical change? I am not that easily duped.
AJ:
You are a glutton for punishment. IMHO, Cheryl is the exact person that is holding up immigration reform because she represents a group that is far larger than the hypochondriac group you are so fond of debasing. Lumping her, myself, and many other Americans with the hypochondriacs is where your analysis goes wrong. Don’t get me wrong. Let me be unequivocal in this point – Tancredo is an idiot and his position is a sure election loser.
I agree with Cheryl. If you read her post she is not a bigot, or a hypochondriac nor is she anti-amnesty. The 1986 amnesty carried a promise that it would be the last amnesty. That broken promise is the craw of I would estimate a majority of ameircans who are pro-immigration but anti-big government; and who are as mad as hell that they have been lied to so much for so many years.
The broken promises of enforcement and the lies that have been fed to the american people for 20 plus years have led to numerous unintended consequences that Cheryl listed above. Rights to people who shouldn’t have them, health care issues, education issues, drug issues, gang issues, identity theft issues, and criminal prosecution issues. By far the largest unintended consequence was inability of Congress to address the immigration issue in a rational manner these 20 plus years. The disgust level on the part of open minded reasonable conservatives is hard to measure or describe.
It is this passion that Tancredo and his ilk attempted to tap into to as in the civil war you mentioned above. The only roadblock was the fact that most people like myself are pro-immigration and wouldn’t vote for Tancredo if he was the only person on the ballot.
That has left Boehner in a difficult position. He must isolate the hypochondriacs in his caucus and also decrease their numbers without losing the angry conservatives like myself. I think Boehner needs to build support among those solid conservatives who are afraid to look soft on immigration. A good start would be to apolgize to the American people for the broken promise of 1986 and for all the lies these past 20 years. I would come all out for the wall and border control as fast as the feds can make it so. I would delay (because this policy is in reality a slow drip deportation) implementation of the employer verification sytem until after border control is slowing the influx of new illegals to a trickle. Then I would support an earned amnesty. Then a reform of the entire immigration code (read increase legal immigration). A process that will take us to 2012 to complete.
The one conclusion I agree with you AJ is that an amnesty is coming. Either the democrats will get enough of a majority to pass a blanket amnesty or the Reasonable Republicans (RINO) will pass one. The problem with the comprehensive bill is that it is a comprehensive bill and the issue must be navigated by successive bills over a period of time. An almost impossible way to go politically.
It is a long shot and I think only Rudy can pull it off. Although, I prefer Thompson I think I’m going to vote for Rudy when my turn comes.
p.s. Romney and McCain are dead. Huckabee will be a tough nut to crack and I would prefer he run for Senate again.
MarkM,
An “Amnesty Hypochondriac” is someone so afraid of going with the bill’s solution on long term illegal aliens they would allow the bill to be torpedoed and keep us at risk to terrorist and criminals. Honestly I could care less about their rationalization or motivations. The conclusion is dangerous and a bit hysterical.
I will also note the insults to those who disagreed with these views is why there is so little support for the GOP.
So forget about this biggot stuff. Insults and hysterical over reaction is sufficient for me to hold back my support! Tancredo’s ilk just make those two other problems even worse.
But, AJ, the problem is “comprehensive immigration reform”. We have been lied to before. I do not believe one solid word that comes from the democrat (and most of the republican) side of the aisle. They will agree to a “compromise”, get the part they want, and ditch the rest. It is already established that we have plenty of liberals in our education system, our federal, state and city governments and our judicial system (and our CIA, and our FBI, and, and, and ….) They pick and choose which laws to enforce. You know this is true. You write about it all the time.
We agree on a lot – I visit your site every day. I also agree we need to do something to identify everyone that is in the country. But, you see, they won’t enforce it. They will legalize the illegals and they won’t enforce the border. I don’t know if it is the liberals wanting votes or the big business wanting cheap labor, we both know that this will be ignored. We have ample examples of the truth of this.
AND, if your insistence that they be identified – heck, we get hamstrung by the liberal judges every time we try. They are being “racially profiled” or whatever little nit-picky reason they can find to throw the law out, so that ends it and they just continue to pour over the border. Heck, we can’t even identify who is voting. Liberal judges throw those laws out as fast as they are enacted or voted in. Or, the poll workers just choose not to enforce the law. I have been politically involved my entire life, and even I am beginning to think that my vote doesn’t matter much.
I’m not sure what the solution is, but I do not believe any promises made to enforce the laws. Although it throws me into that group of “Tancredo’s ilk” I simply cannot support legalizing misdemeanor lawbreakers (I do not believe identity theft is a misdemeanor, but I’m a Certified Financial Planner and Enrolled Agent, not a lawyer). And while I’m on the subject, I am a tax professional, and I can promise you that “getting them to pay back taxes” will also be relegated to a joke. They’ll qualify for Earned Income Credit and all the other goodies that our congress chooses to hand out, so in reality, their “back taxes” will be paid by you and me. But, hey, that’s a good fig leaf for people who don’t understand taxes, right?
My whole point is, based on what has happened since the 1986 “comprehensive immigration reform” we have been lied to constantly and I expect nothing more from the 2007-2008 “comprehensive immigration reform”. It is a lie, based on past lies, based on democrats desire for votes and big business’ desire for cheap labor. The rest of us just get to shut up and pay the bill. I’m totally tired of it. I would just like the existing laws enforced, and let’s see what happens. If they won’t enforce the existing laws, what makes you think they will enforce a new one?
Cheryl
Cheryl,
You were lied to when people said existing laws were OK. They aren’t. If you wait for perfection out of the Congress nothing will get done. It would have been better to pass it and build off of it.
But that is all gone now – all you have is the same 1986 laws, congrats. Don’t expect anything close to that bill for years to come. Anything to come from a Dem Congress will be MUCH worse. Conservatives had a shot and blew it. I’m an independent – so al I measure is results. Rhetoric is BS (I grew up outside DC – I know).
People may not like my conclusion and predictions – but they are coming true and being born out. I don’t blow sunshine – not my style.
But, AJ, they aren’t enforcing existing laws. THEY ARE STILL LYING. What makes you think they will enforce new ones?
I never expect perfection, I expect disasters. I am right now dealing with the potential AMT fallout, because this do nothing congress has not dealt with the hard stuff. I had a client with 5 children and a normal Schedule A (you know – mortgage interest, etc) who is going to be his with $3,331 in AMT. He left my office shell-shocked.
New laws mean nothing if the liberal teachers, emergency rooms, cities, states and CIA, FBI et al choose not to enforce them. Treason is now in, don’t you know? That’s my point.
I’m not disagreeing with your main points, we are disagreeing on the system of enforcement. You trust that they will do what they say. I don’t.
Cheryl
PS, love your site and I am not trying to be a site pest.
Cheryl,
You are not being a pest – you are debating (and doing a damn good job of it!). I just keep looking at the lack of progress and the false statements. Those were bad enough. But the vitriol from the far right (and that probably does not include you are most of my readers) destroyed the coalition. El Presidente Jorge Bush is still in office – the right is now the minority. Bottom line is everything in DC.
We agree on that. I just want the few laws we have left to be enforced. I agree about the debate, I love to discuss this without all the rhetoric and canards. Let’s just cut to the chase.
I agree about the right being the minority, and that is sad, but we carry a lot of baggage on our side, just like the dems have Code Pink and all.
Bottom line is I don’t trust them. They say all this stuff – right or left – and don’t mean it – they are just trying to get votes. That should be the total topic of our conversation. Remember “SHOW ME THE MONEY!!!”. Right now, I feel like “SHOW ME THE ENFORCEMENT!!!”
I’m becoming an independent, but I cannot say that I will ever vote for a Democrat. I just cannot support that. That leaves Republicans, with all their faults. ICK.
Start talking big time about the AMT. That is going to be the topic if they don’t get something done by next Friday. I am not kidding – this is going to be the topic of tax season, simply because electronic filing is going to be stymied until the IRS and software vendors can get the fix that congress is supposedly doing programmed. We’ve been told 7 weeks from the date of signature on the legislation. I just went to The Hill, and it is still not decided. I’m going to a tax update seminar tomorrow, and I guarantee you this will be the topic of discussion. What do we do? How do we advise clients? How do we tell people making $107k with 5 children and a normal mortgage that they have to dig out $3k for AMT to get right with the IRS next year. Nancy wants offsets on a tax that is not even included in the calculation. Holy cow, this is as important a discussion as the Iraq war right now. But it isn’t even being looked at, except at sites that focus on that. You’ll be “ahead of the curve”.
I enjoy the debate. El Presidente, with all his faults are the only thing right now preventing us from becoming a socialist country. Good on him for that.
Cheryl
AJ, hi and thanks for persistently addressing this issue with intelligence and clarity. You actually DO speak for me, unlike the myriad demagogues on TV and Radio CLAIMING to speak for me.
So, the last call I got from the RNC for $$ was a 50-something guy who sounded like a toxic mix of Glenn Beck & Sean Hannity… I start to tell him I’m not inclined to funnel any money into the sinking ship at this point and I mention immigration as part of the problem… he immediately cuts me off and says, “yeah, Bush really betrayed us didn’t he?” Well, I’m glad you weren’t there AJ, to witness my George Carlinesque response including all 7 unmentionable words plus 7 made up on the spot. Oh, and the guy didn’t back off for a second… he proceeded to accuse me of also betraying America and the party blah blah. What am I supposed to think when a guy like that calls ME, to ask for MY money, and representing MY party apparatus?
I’m exhausted with the whole mess. The Right is cracked and crumbling. I’m concentrating on my kitchen remodeling and intensely following weather reports.
Merry Christmas to everyone in the Stratasphere.
~SallyVee
I hope you still get notified if a comment shows up in an old story. If I had your email, I would have just emailed you!
The proof of my statements above is on Michelle Malkin’s site today. You cannot trust them to enforce the border. They will talk about it, but when the rubber meets the road – they just want the illegals, not the enforcement. That’s just blather to get us to go along with them.
I get the notices.
Sorry, no sale. All those who stayed home or pissed off moderates and let the Dems take Congress are getting what they deserve.
Like I said – you folks had your chances (twice) and blew it. You preferred nothing and got it. Deal with it.
Remember how proud you all were when you defeated these bills. Be proud now, this is the result.
Actually, I would never stay home and not vote. In fact, both of my mid-twenties children vote regularly, because we have always taken them with us when we went to vote, because as far as I’m concerned voting is one of the responsibilities of living in the USA. Those who threaten to stay home and not vote sicken me.
And, actually, we haven’t blown it – and furthermore, I am proud that we stood up last summer and said enough. This is causing a lot of things to change that would not have even been considered a year ago. Here in AZ, the stories are coming out daily now about how the “poor” illegals are worried that if they go home for Christmas, they won’t be able to get back in the US, or their employer will run their info to determine legality (which is going into effect here in AZ on 1/1 unless the liberal judges have their way) and they won’t have a job. They are self-deporting. This will not take care of the entire problem, but it will take care of a lot of it. This is happening all over the US where local governments are beginning to fill the gap being left by our federal government.
I agree that there is going to have to be something done about the anchor babies and so forth, but rewarding illegal behavior with benefits and legal immigration status is not the solution. Especially when they authorize a carrot and a stick, and then throw away the stick, a la Michelle Malkin’s site today. And that is my point. They have and will lie straight to your face about this in order to get your support.
Aw, come on, don’t give up – I’m not through arguing!!
GOP slow Fundraising
AJ, you sound like a frightened, pandering Johnny-come-lately who still doesn’t get it! You seem to be ignorant of the history and issues of the struggle against illegal aliens. There are other, good reasons for slow GOP fund raising. Even the Democratic leadership admits they have a problem with anti-illegal alien adherents.
We started the fight early here in San Diego – right after the 1986 bill was passed. We had over 2000 illegals coming across every night. They were urinating and defecating on our lawns, tearing down fences and outbuildings, letting livestock loose, spoiling wells, leaving water running, overpopulating schools, hospitals and jails, taking jobs from skilled workers, usurping our social services, carrying drugs, killing citizens and illegals by speeding down freeways on the wrong side trying to escape the border patrol, etc. They were robbing, raping and killing (3/night) each other coming across the border. Border patrolmen who were effective in stemming the flow were either fired or transferred. When memos from management directing the patrolmen to not enforce the law were leaked, new orders were given orally.
Citizens initiated a “Light up the Borders†program, where each night they would drive down and shine their headlights toward the border. Eventually the Patrol installed stadium lights. With complaints and illegals still coming the Patrol replaced the three strand fence with a steel landing mat fence. But, in their infinite wisdom, they installed them with horizontal ridges for climbing instead of vertical ridges. Still the immigrants came. After some belated analysis they concluded they needed a triple fence, because as soon as they started chasing the illegals, they would climb back over the fence. A double fence was compromised on, installed and was over 90% effective.
During this time some politicians spoke out. Bush ’41 promised to triple the Border Patrol. So, after a few years, the Wash D.C. office location got a few more employees. Whenever Gov. Pete Wilson spoke out, he was misquoted, mischaracterized, and vilified by our extreme liberal media. Whenever he said “illegal immigrant the word “illegal†was dropped. But then, whenever the middle school dropouts pretending to be reporters, wrote on the issue, they dropped the word “illegal†anyway. Our San Diego Union Tribune published a sob-sister story every week about some struggling illegal alien family plus all kinds of news from south of our border. They totally ignored news from Orange County, immediately north of us, with similar economy, demographics and aspirations.
AJ, your incredible statement that we are “too small to win elections, and apparently too small to fund them as wellâ€, ignores successful campaigns in CA and AZ. In CA 64 percent of whites, 57 percent of Asian-Americans, 56 percent of African-Americans, and 31 percent of Latinos voted in favor of Prop. 187 to reduce benefits to illegals. It was pigeon-holed for several years in our (liberal) court system until a Democratic governor was elected so he could stop the appeals.
AJ you also missed recent approval of AZ laws. Thank God for AZ. More power to the “Zoniesâ€. (Zonies- those who populate San Diego beaches in the summertime.)
In CA we have been beaten down much longer than others. Many have lost their spirit to fight. Governor Schwarzenegger refuses to fight. The state legislature is gerrymandered against the Republicans. All media is liberal and suppresses or misrepresents issues and vilifies anyone speaking out against illegal aliens. Any attempt to remove large, illegal encampments in our canyons in our cities is met with vile, insults from the media and illegals proponents. Our peaceful demonstrations are met with violence; the media say we start it; we successfully defend ourselves in court with video, but this is under-reported. (Did you see it?) Many hospitals are still closing because they can’t afford the illegals, whereas expenses for medical care and insurance is rising for those who are legal. And we are being out-populated. The “Vital Ratio” (in the United States) among whites is one birth to one death and among Hispanics is eight births to one death which creates a disproportionate imbalance in the population. Overturning the double fence law and funding in the recent Omnibus bell has drawn the last gasp from many of us.
Former cabinet secretaries Bill Bennett and Jack Kemp attacked California Governor Wilson for supporting Prop. 187. They argued that immigrants are “natural Republicans” who support low taxes and family values, and that Wilson risks turning the Republican party into a party of protectionism and xenophobia.
I also believe that immigrants are “natural Republicansâ€. But, I believe a strong, non-pandering leader who speaks out against illegal immigration and in support of the strong moral, family, and independent values of Hispanics can win their votes and many Democratic and Independent votes. Upon being denigrated by the elitist, liberal media, they can point out the media’s racist, xenophobic, multiculturalism.