May 03 2009
Silly GOP Outreach Is Laughable And Preachy
Update: John Cole notes how the purity wars keep distilling the conservative movement into oblivion by how the definition of ‘moderate’ keeps changing in defining ‘true conservatives’.
Once Collins and Snowe are drummed out of the party, the definition of what is “moderate†will change yet again. The music will stop, and Lindsey Graham, with his ACU rating of 90, will find himself without a seat because he isn’t conservative enough.
So true. But only those who will be pure and true to the cause will be left standing – in the irrelevant minority! – end update
OK, I was a huge Michael Steele fan, but now that he has gone into the ‘true conservative’ (their name for themselves, not something I made up) fever swamps he is sounding as incoherent as they do:
Republican National Committee Chairman Michael Steele appealed to the political middle Friday to join his party but added that the party itself wouldn’t moderate.
“All you moderates out there, y’all come. I mean, that’s the message,” Steele said at a news conference. “The message of this party is this is a big table for everyone to have a seat. I have a place setting with your name on the front.
“Understand that when you come into someone’s house, you’re not looking to change it. You come in because that’s the place you want to be.”
A table where we are ridiculed and muzzled? ROTFLMAO! Dude, we are the ones who fund your message and swing elections! What makes you think we want to come into that???? Not until we see a complete cleaning of the house. Otherwise, enjoy the echo chamber. Most of us are already out of the house – gladly out of the house.
How about you folks get a grip and start listening to Peggy Noonan (who I have lost a lot of respect for over the last few years, but who is talking common sense on this subject):
Another way to put the question is: Can the party, having accurately ascertained its position, and recognizing shifting terrain, institute a renewed and highly practical tolerance for the many flavors of Republican? Can it live happily and productively with all its natural if sometimes warring constituent groups?
It must.
Here’s the point Steele and the deflated ‘true conservatives’ forget. If we are in a coalition it is a house we all own together. We all sit at the table as equals, speak as equals and treated with the respect of equals.. If the true right cannot stomach that there is a small shed out back they can squat in, but the mainstream political kitchen table debate is happening in America’s house, not in the ‘true conservative’ shack.
I am unhappy with both parties but I don’t want to be an independent. I wish there is a party that I can fully support. That party has to believe and implement fiscally conservative principles, foreign policy, and follow the US Constitution. Foreign policy should be implemented to guarantee the strength and diplomatic ace that can be used in our favor.
Since Carter with the minor exception of Bush, we’ve never had the diplomatic ace up our sleeves to use in our favor. Otherwise, NK and Iran wouldn’t be pursuing nukes. Otherwise, Hamas, Hizb’allah, and Fatah would begin to get along with us withOUT propagandizing their kids to hate us.
None of the parties that I have found will follow the right principles as defined by the FF’s. The problem with the Modern Whig Party is that they have no record to show us that they will follow the platform.
“The problem with the Modern Whig Party is that they have no record to show us that they will follow the platform.”
Yeah, and no record that shows they won’t run nut cases like the Libertarian Party does. If they run loony tunes candidates with a platform of asteroid mining like I have seen from the Libertarians, then they can go suck rocks as far as I am concerned.
I like part of the platform of the Libertarian party. I like Larry Elder. I like some of the policies that Ron Paul believes in but there are other parts that I don’t like about Ron Paul. I did hear him speak at my tea party. He is a good speaker and speaks the right words. But I don’t like his foreign policy.
And I agree with you, CP, about the Modern Whig Party. It’s their to lose.
The Republican party has similar problems…by backing up the wrong person. Arlen Specter comes to mind.
Goldwatergirl… Ditto… btw, I had a [very] small blog until after Nov 4…Had Aj as #1…of 6… others I recommended…
.
Not that it matters…but…now I cannot now recommend that ANYONE ELSE read the Strata-Sphere blog…although I still do… if that makes any sense…Aj has simply become too virulent and divisive
.
Virulent: Objectionably harsh or strong…
Full of malice…
Bitterly hostile or antagonistic…
a barrage of acid comments…
However… [I think] Aj is a very smart person…Capable of change… Let’s hope so…
Peggy Noonan took an incomprehensibly obtuse position regarding Sarah Palin last fall. She, Frum, Parker and a few other of whom the media eagerly, and suddenly very respectfully labeled “conservative”, greatly undermined their own party by arrogantly attacking Palin. Their deed was doubly bad given that they were presented by the media as reasonable and authoritative voices of the right, which was what we all pretty much thought they were.
These people did incalculable damage to the ticket, and are now whining about how radical left Obama is, something we uneducated fringies on the right knew instinctively from day one. Worse yet, now they wish to counsel us on election strategy. No thanks.
Two bellwether issues have apparently moved significantly in the conservative direction, over a fairly short time, according to this poll.
Gun rights have become much more popular at the expense of gun control in the last year. Overall it’s gone from being +21 for control to only +5 for control.
But independents have gone from +17 control to -3. Having a pro-gun stance has gone from being an apparent liability for the GOP with independents to being an asset, as more of them are for gun rights now.
Among Republicans, support for gun rights has further strengthened substantially from +21 to +34.
On abortion, in just eight months, overall the gap between should be always/sometimes legal and should be always/sometimes illegal has shrunk from +13 legal to only +2 legal.
Looking at independents, support for abortion has shrunk from +15 legal to -1 legal. In other words, having a pro-life stance has gone from being a substantial problem for the GOP with independents to being a very slight advantage.
And among Republicans, the already meager support for abortion has eroded quite a bit, moving from +15 illegal to +31 illegal.
Now, I’d tend to be a little suspicious of this much movement in such a short time. But if this poll is accurate, and especially if they’re over-samplng democrats again, this doesn’t look to be a very good time to be considering moving much if any in the moderate direction.
This coupled with the earlier Rasmussen poll saying that only 17% of Republicans think their party is too conservative, and that more independents think the GOP is just right or not conservative enough than thinking it needs to be more moderate.
For those who still wonder why Arlen Specter’s defection should be a cause for celebration, here’s a report on what he said on Face the Nation this morning about Democratic vs. Republican spending priorities …
“Sen. Arlen Specter, Pennsylvania Democrat, said part of the reason he left the Republican Party last week was disillusionment with its healthcare priorities, and suggested that had the Republicans taken a more moderate track, Jack Kemp may have won his battle with cancer … If we had pursued what President Nixon declared in 1970 as the war on cancer, we would have cured many strains. I think Jack Kemp would be alive today.”
Right … using Jack Kemp to further Arlen’s effort to justify his switch … unconscionable, but hardly surprising coming from him.
Those are the terms we have been given. No compromise. Fine – no compromise. That means showing America why the true right is completely wrong and a waste of their time, and convincing them that the only path forward to oppose Obama’s folly is a centrist coalition who can come together, compromise, and be an agent for a new, brighter future.
CP,
Let’s keep MY record straight here. I have never, ever been a Republican. I have been and independent since 1982. I have no allegiance to either party
Why is the ‘true right’ is completely wrong. Well, the ‘true far left’ is very wrong and it sure didn’t keep them from taking over.
Ok, you were never a republican, but you were a conservative? at least you used to claim you were.. you recently have said you have left the conservatives. Palin will miss your support.
I’m not sure what’s behind your recent decision to not stand for anything except trying to tell conservatives that they are wrong and should abandon their principles. Why don’t you spend at least half as much time telling us why the socialists are wrong and should abandon their principles. In fact the more they stood together, the stronger they got until they got a full blown socialist elected. They sure as hell didn’t comprise to get a coalition. The far right may be wrong, but at least I don’t see them calling for the utter destruction of the country as the socialists are.
why the lamenting Specter following your lead of deserting the conservatives? Specter has always been a dishonest politician that has never stood for anything except re-election. There’s a huge gap between people such as Snowe and Collins that at least some times attempt to stand for something, Specter has never been anything but dishonest. But then he’s a politician, should we expect more?
Republicans cannot do squat as long as they prefer purity over political power. Now I may be wrong, but it sounds as if you’re saying that a preacher should preach what the people want to hear instead of preaching what he believes. That’s why I don’t go to church. Too many people there are hypocrites, that why I wouldn’t want to be a conservative if the objective of conservatives was to be hypocrites. If you don’t stand for something, you’ll fall for anything as the old saying goes. I’m for closing the damn borders and controlling who is going in an out. That’s a conservative belief and if they’re going to sell out on that, they may as well be a democrat. Now you might call that a ‘far right ‘ position, but I’ll call it a ‘just plain right’ position. Here is a quote I heard on tv just today. “I used to think of myself as a person that took the high ground but lately I’ve been thinking that sometimes you have to look out for yourself” You seem to be advocating that people that used to take the high ground should abandon it for expediency of winning elections, of compromising, of getting a coalition. It’s more important to win than to have principles. Timothy Geithner put having money ahead of paying taxes, in fact, I think the majority of Obama’s admin is likely guilty of that. Those people running Fannie and Freddie put getting huge bonuses ahead of keeping the agencies solvent.
I have owned a small business in the past and I can assure you that some people will steal from you, and some have principles. The people on the far right should stand firmly on the side of right, in their opinion and judgment, just as those on the left are standing firmly on the side of the left. Let those in the middle then sway with the breeze and go in the direction that they are swayed to go. Most of those in the middle that are leaning left are doing so because they think they will get something for nothing. When they find out that the ones that will be getting something for nothing are the crooks running the fannie’s and freddie’s and such and it’s gonna cost them, they’ll sway back the other way. The pinch is already starting to squeeze them, Obama’s popularity, in accurate polls, is declining and it’s a slippery slope. As I’ve said before, people are free to have whatever opinion they desire to have in this country, many people have fought and died for that right. Now we have people in this country, presently running the government, that don’t want people to be free to have their own opinions any more. No secret ballots on labor elections, no gun ownership. Most of those people have never worn a uniform and have no respect for those that did. I don’t think there is much room for compromise, those aren’t the principles I stand for. Bipartisan has always been accurately defined as the Republicans doing what the Democrats want them to do, it is no different today.
Dems are already calling Specter a “DINO”
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2009_05/018015.php
Pollster.com has averaged the Party ID polls an concluded:
“The most striking feature of the chart is not the drop in Republicans, but rather the increase in independent identification. The decline in Republican ID is a nearly parallel decline for the Democrats.”
http://www.pollster.com/blogs/new_our_party_id_chart.php
And,
A Ray of Sunshine for the GOP in State Races
Smartly selected local candidates are making a huge difference.
May 1, 2009 – by Jennifer Rubin
It seems that all is bleak for Republicans these days. Sen. Arlen Specter has defected. Sen. Norm Coleman is nearing the end of his appeals. And the Democratic president is riding sky-high in the polls. But beneath the surface, or more specifically out in the country, something is happening: Republicans are winning races.
Read the whole thing at:
http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/a-ray-of-sunshine-for-the-gop-in-state-races/
gary1son
Peggy Noonan took an incomprehensibly obtuse position regarding Sarah Palin last fall. She, Frum, Parker and a few other of whom the media eagerly, and suddenly very respectfully labeled “conservativeâ€, greatly undermined their own party by arrogantly attacking Palin. Their deed was doubly bad given that they were presented by the media as reasonable and authoritative voices of the right,
Letting the media define conservatives is not new.
But I strongly supported Palin and would likely be defined as a ‘conservative’ ,and I don’t like what Obama is attempting to do, so I sure don’t fit in your pigeon hole.
In my opinion, there are more conservatives that supported Palin than opposed her and most of those don’t like Obama. Conservatives aren’t the cause of McCain’s defeat, Palin is not the cause. McCain was the problem, in his political positions, not his personal traits, there was little difference in his positions and those of Obama. There didn’t cause the right leaning people to turn out strongly and so he lost. Obama got what Gore and Kerry got, McCain got a lot less than Bush did. That was the difference. I voted for McCain, but not enthusiastically.
Frogg,
Specter, is a PFS, (politician for sure)
Redteam,
I think you may have somewhat misinterpreted what I said, and after reading me over, I don’t blame you. 🙂 Certainly didn’t mean to pigeon-hole anyone, really, except for the media maybe, and they are indeed almost all in the same nest.
The vast, vast majority of those of us on the right voted enthusiastically for Palin and her running mate. However, there were a few high-profile guys and gals the media presented as uber-smart reasoned folks on the right opposing their own VP nominee. That was a powerful message that probably affected mainly those on the fence, who were given some supposedly very good high-minded justifications by well-spoken supposedly credible people for not choosing the Pub ticket. Not that this was necessarily a primary reason for the outcome, there were many, including McCain himself as you point out, but I suspect it influenced a lot of votes.
But there we have that media once again in there jumping on any opportunity to wield their influence with the fence-sitters, always coaxing them leftward. And what a golden one Noonan & Co. willingly and no doubt eloquently provided.
Redteam,
What makes you think I am not supporting Palin? I prefer her over all the true conservatives out there. She is the one person I would walk over hot coals for.
She is what DC and the GOP needs. Smart, takes on the establishment, family oriented, is religious but doesn’t preach, and she is not a true conservative.
She is a reformer.
The fact is the GOP lost because the far right sat out the election in a snit. They have been taking their marbles home when they aren’t insulting everyone who disagrees with them (and there is plenty of policy space between the far right and the far right that is reasonable).
When they walked, they did not realize the door would not be open for them later. They are just realizing how much clout they gave up.
And no one is shedding a single tear over their loss.
BTW Redteam, I regularly post on how dumb the liberal stimulus bill was and how it will come back to bite them. Aren’t you reading those posts?
Let’s not forget that it was McCain who first had the “snit”. He angrily pooped on religious conservatives in 2000 amidst losing out to Bush.
He’s the one who first “walked”, and only belatedly “realized that the door would not be open for him later”, as he attempted to mend fences.
If he hadn’t trashed those fences in the first place, he probably would have gotten a lot more support from these folks, although their (partial) defection was only one of many factors in the outcome. His politically motivated embracement of Hagee was another blunder that cost him a lot of support within many groups.
He didn’t have to quote scripture. All he had to do was show genuine respect, and identify and embrace the many things they had in common.
This is actually what Obama did his first time out, albeit in many ways disingenuously and deceitfully.
Redteam,
Couldn’t agree with you more, well put! I consider Sarah Palin to be ubber conservative, and she has my support! I don’t know where the moderate or reformer moniker came from.
I think she was fried by the MSM and liberals out of pure fear! Why else would they send a team of investigators and lawers to do what they did. Don’t forget the press will spin up any story they can as political cover for Obama and company.
AJ
What makes you think I am not supporting Palin? I prefer her over all the true conservatives out there. She is the one person I would walk over hot coals for.
Because you said, on April 14:
To my chagrin two things happened with this story which ended my desire to be associated with ‘conservatives’ (no matter how much sense their policies may make).
Palin is certainly in the conservatives that their policies make sense, the very type you said you have no desire to be associated with.
I wasn’t trying to put words in your mouth,, just quoting yours.
I regularly post on how dumb the liberal stimulus bill was and how it will come back to bite them. Aren’t you reading those posts?
I read ALL your posts.
The fact is the GOP lost because the far right sat out the election in a snit. They have been taking their marbles home when they aren’t insulting
Absolutely, as I said, I voted for McCain as he was far superior to Obama. Unlike the Dems who held their noses and voted.
gary1son,
yes I agree, I think McCain lost the election of 2008 in 2000. He never recovered and the Dems knew it, that’s why they got him elected in the primaries. they knew the race would be over if he got the nomination. And it was.
the only thing that got him within shouting distance was Palin. AS of now, I’m for Palin for the 2012 campaign, with Jindal as VP.